[P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !

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Sure. Thanks Dante. Thanks Michel for the link!


On Tue, Dec 24, 2013 at 4:56 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson <
dante.monson at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Brent,
>
> there is some convergence happening via
>
> http://bwcd.vdcn.org/doku.php
>
> *" Let's get some cool people together and live in a tribe / family / team
> / intentional community. Experiment with better ways to live, and make the
> world a cooler place. We'll work together to survive and look after each
> other. "*
>
> Email :
>
> http://bwcd.vdcn.org/doku.php/email_list
>
> ///
>
> Further approaches can be discussed there ?
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Michel Bauwens <michel at p2pfoundation.net
> > wrote:
>
>> hi Brent, I have aggregated the wide variety of open business models at
>> http://p2pfoundation.net/Category:Business_Models
>>
>> not only are there solutions, but there are plenty of solutions, the key
>> question is of course finding the one that fits with your particular
>> project ...
>>
>> but the general scheme, building a community around a commons, and create
>> a market entity around it (such as a coop), works well
>>
>> Michel
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 10:59 PM, Brent Shambaugh <
>> brent.shambaugh at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> Since around mid-march or so I've spent time trying to refining the
>>> ideas from my Distributed Economy blog (
>>> http://www.adistributedeconomy.blogspot.com/) into a proposal. I kind
>>> of felt like I was teaching myself all of computer science. Even though I
>>> felt I was learning quite a bit, it came at a considerable cost to myself.
>>> It is hard to think in a peer-to-peer fashion while questioning the fabric
>>> of academia and industry. I felt that I did not fit in anywhere and was
>>> unsure build a business model around it. Physically, it seemed that way
>>> too. I also became very cynical. I grew isolated, but thought I needed time
>>> for self-study so what I was writing was credible, competitive and lucid
>>> enough that I could put faith in it to be confident with others. Still,
>>> it's scope was huge, enough to be not taken seriously by itself I guess. I
>>> felt I basically was trying to change the operating system of the planet,
>>> and everything else was built on top of that (businesses, academia,
>>> etc...). Was the value network the business model? That, and maybe support?
>>> Do I just try to start something like Linux and hope for the best? That's
>>> the sort of scale I was envisioning. Fortunately, the web efforts have done
>>> a lot of the groundwork. It's more of a use then. It's hard to say I did
>>> much beyond understanding and some aggregation of connections that others
>>> might not have seen. People tell you to hold on to some things in private,
>>> while at the same time you want to integrate with the rest of the
>>> community. Maybe what I have is significant, maybe it is not. It would be
>>> great to share it. I believe enough in it to think it could help people.
>>> I'm almost done with what seems to resemble a 20 page outline. I do not
>>> want to fragment the community (or be fragmented from it), but at the same
>>> time I need some sustainable way to survive. Paradoxically, it seems it
>>> needs the support and the efforts and the ideas of the community to
>>> succeed. Are there any solutions? I'm sorry if I come off as arrogant in
>>> any way.
>>>
>>> -Brent
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 11:50 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson <
>>> dante.monson at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Thanks Eric
>>>>
>>>> Yes, I'd be glad to follow up on the thinking and research you are
>>>> doing around metacurrency, and participate in the scheduled hang out.
>>>>
>>>> further note :
>>>> an interesting reply by June on this thread,
>>>> also available on the public p2pf list archive
>>>>
>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>    - [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is
>>>>    understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg01085.html>
>>>>     Dante-Gabryell Monson
>>>>       - Re: [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested
>>>>       is understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg01087.html>
>>>>        June Gorman
>>>>       - Re: [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested
>>>>       is understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg01088.html>
>>>>        Dante-Gabryell Monson
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:43 PM, Eric Harris-Braun <
>>>> eric at harris-braun.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi All,
>>>>>
>>>>> It turns out that where the technical side of the MetaCurrency Project
>>>>> has led us has lots to do with Semantic Data or rather, from our point of
>>>>> view, Semantic Computing.  Ceptr, the computing stack we are designing to
>>>>> build our tools out of, pushes Semantics down into the lowest levels of the
>>>>> stack, in a way that we haven't seen with the approaches inherent embodied
>>>>> in RDF/URI.
>>>>>
>>>>> For folks interested in our approach, I'm scheduling a tech hang-out
>>>>> in the next week or two. If you want to be notified of it please drop me a
>>>>> line.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Eric
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 11:51 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson <
>>>>> dante.monson at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> *pre-note : I try to understand if we can , possibly collectively, *
>>>>>> *write an article that could be published on the p2pfoundation blog,*
>>>>>> *as to better explain, in words and with images / graphics , *
>>>>>> *some of the potentials of building on, for example, Linked Data -
>>>>>> and/or similar technologies enabling us to more easily redefine our
>>>>>> realities collectively -*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *If anyone wrote on these topics, or is interested in combining our
>>>>>> efforts and research in writing about these topics, or if some can help in
>>>>>> making such article in a enjoyable reading moment ( combining it with nice
>>>>>> imagery and stories ? Like some science fiction authors manage to do - yet
>>>>>> talking about the present ? ) it would be great.   I mean, not only about
>>>>>> one specific application or project, but about the potential to work
>>>>>> together on various applications based on common protocols. *
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Some call it a "Global Brain" , or a "Web Operating System" , ... *
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Below is what I want to say to open up the topics for now ... I am
>>>>>> open to brainstorm further, and progressively collectively organize an
>>>>>> easier to understand blog post, or series of blog posts, on such topics.*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks Bob, Thanks Helene,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> for your replies.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I sent this message initially motivated by the realization, after an
>>>>>> email exchange with Michel.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Michel pointed that in his view there seemed to be little interest
>>>>>> regarding Linked Data / Semantic Web approaches on p2pf related forums.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So I wondered if this was really the case, and if so, what could be
>>>>>> the reason,
>>>>>> and how could it be better communicated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Possibly showing how different projects may have an interest in using
>>>>>> such technologies in their research and development of applications,
>>>>>> showing overlap of different applications that want to embody such
>>>>>> technologies,
>>>>>> and overlap and re-use of the data generated by each of these
>>>>>> applications to enable yet new applications.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For example, Bob in collaboration with Sensorica for Open Value
>>>>>> Network tools...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Although the technologies can be re-used and adapted for a variety of
>>>>>> applications,
>>>>>> hence Netention ( mostly Seth coding for now ) researching
>>>>>> approaches, and inviting others into such research and development, which
>>>>>> hopefully can be re-used for Open Value Networks, or for alternative forms
>>>>>> of learning building on available information on our wiki's , etc
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Other projects, such as metamaps, are also interested ( or already
>>>>>> including ) such approaches ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pavlik was already talking about FOAF ( one aspect / approach using
>>>>>> Linked Data concepts ) many years ago.  I now notice Pavlik is regaining
>>>>>> interest, including in Schema and Json , ... midst others, in support of
>>>>>> Sharing Economy applications ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ///
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But in a larger sense, I feel it is about contributing to the
>>>>>> development of remedies regarding Anoptism ( which Olivier talks about ,
>>>>>> http://p2pfoundation.net/Anoptism , while facilitating at first
>>>>>> Holoptism )
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the understanding which I developed by interacting with Seth and
>>>>>> others via lists such as "Global Survival List"<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/global-survival>
>>>>>> ,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> such Web 3.0 approaches get us closer to the concept of " Noosphere "
>>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noosphere
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Or should I be already speaking of Web 4.0 , since I can notice a
>>>>>> convergence with artificial intelligence.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> See :
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://novaspivack.typepad.com/RadarNetworksTowardsAWebOS.jpg
>>>>>> ( and another graph about internet evolution
>>>>>> http://www.didael.it/sito/evoluzione_web.htm  , also calling some
>>>>>> phases we have technologies for and for which we need more collaboration in
>>>>>> research to reduce the threshold for its usage , "the metaweb"
>>>>>> http://koolaidantidote.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/metaweb_graph.gif
>>>>>>  )
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Emergent Collective Consciousness, Approaches to Collective
>>>>>> Intelligence, to Emergent forms of Networked Political Economies, ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> and can be combined with , for example, understanding in the field of
>>>>>> Artificial Intelligence. ( could be interesting to refer to the Global
>>>>>> Brain Institute ? http://globalbraininstitute.org/ )
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are so many implications regarding decision making,
>>>>>> collaboration and collective intelligence, learning, resource allocation ,
>>>>>> and even finance...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I see a lot of parallels between the potentials of Linked Data
>>>>>> approaches,
>>>>>> and the spirit of the Meta Currency project.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Although there are indeed different potential approaches and
>>>>>> technologies,
>>>>>> and hopefully we can choose inter-operable ones.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are series of existing Ontologies.  RDF Schema being one
>>>>>> approach which seems to be receiving wider acceptance.
>>>>>> There is also the use of Json.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Then there is the potential combination between Folksonomies and
>>>>>> Ontologies, into Folksontologies...    And I did not even mention other
>>>>>> interesting approaches ( slightly different then the W3C approach ? ) ,
>>>>>> such as that of Pierre Levy
>>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_L%C3%A9vy and IEML
>>>>>> http://p2pfoundation.net/Information_Economy_Meta_Language
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At least in spirit, in my understanding of it. - for each
>>>>>> application, various combinations of technologies may been considered,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> yet I see potential in enabling inter-operable formats, and data that
>>>>>> can be re-used along compatible data graph approaches...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How can this best be explained with imagery that anyone could
>>>>>> understand,
>>>>>> and beyond any one specific project ?   Enable the imagery of a new
>>>>>> way of creating and using data... re-using such data, enabling us to
>>>>>> contextualize and choose the ( political and economic ) "games" we play
>>>>>> based on such contextualization layers ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Enabling us to interact with others, and across various applications,
>>>>>> beyond any proprietary approaches, and beyond any social silos...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yet at the same time, enabling "machines" to understand ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Opening up whole new dimensions in terms of what seems to be widely
>>>>>> called "The Internet of Things"<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_of_Things> /
>>>>>> Spimes <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spime> , including in support
>>>>>> of the Sharing Economy, or better still in my view, A Contribution Economy
>>>>>> based on Peer Production in support of the Commons.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That this can be enabled by experimenting further with various
>>>>>> existing modules and protocols... reducing threshold for their usage,
>>>>>> reducing the threshold for generating data together, reducing the threshold
>>>>>> for organizing ourselves using such data ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are many more themes this relates to.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For example, Architecture - Urbanism, etc
>>>>>> ( such as Modular Parametric Design , based on Lego Like components
>>>>>> that can easily be re-assembled ? )
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are also many risks - and in my view, a need to think how we
>>>>>> can be ahead of understanding the technology, to avoid it being used to
>>>>>> trap us in it - and instead use it to liberate and empower us.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please feel free to correct me where you see fit, complement views,
>>>>>> give your own perceptions, etc
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There is existing code from various projects for such kind of "Web
>>>>>> 4.0" browsing - there has been already a lot of research.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In my view, one of the main challenges now, is to get people to work
>>>>>> together on open sourced code and libre licenses,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> for developing inter-operable tools using such open protocols...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Making the various interfaces easier to understand and use...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But first, in my view, we need to see if people grasp these concepts,
>>>>>> and understand that these potentials are very real and are current - and we
>>>>>> can participate in their development, and hopefully soon benefit from its
>>>>>> potentials.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, there is funding available - for those of us who are good with
>>>>>> funding applications - and can enable access to such larger partnerships -,
>>>>>> willing to contribute to the work of programmers, or willing to motivate
>>>>>> programmers to converge around a commons oriented approach -
>>>>>>
>>>>>> see : http://fisa.future-internet.eu/index.php/FIA_Research_Roadmap
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://cordis.europa.eu/fp7/ict/ssai/fp8preparations_en.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Note : There are also all kinds of existing video materials that can
>>>>>> be used to illustrate such concepts...  I am willing to bring them
>>>>>> together.   Those who can do video editing, I d be interested in supporting
>>>>>> research for creating a new video document too, in addition to blog
>>>>>> articles.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Forwarded conversation
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Subject: Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is
>>>>>> understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !
>>>>>>  ------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:50 AM
>>>>>> To: p2p-foundation <p2p-foundation at lists.ourproject.org>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What would be your answer ? ( reply on this list or in private to me )
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *A ) Interested in ( getting to know more about ) its potentials*
>>>>>> *B ) Not interested*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> and
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *1 ) Never heard of Linked Data
>>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data>*
>>>>>> *2 ) Know about it*
>>>>>> *3 ) Actively researching Linked Data
>>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data> applications ( in support of p2p
>>>>>> 4 commons ? )*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ( or whatever other replies you wish to give )
>>>>>>
>>>>>> //
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Context of my question :
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Michel noted that in his view Linked Data has not been a topic with
>>>>>> much interest on the p2pf related forums.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I wish to understand if this is simply because not many of us know
>>>>>> about Linked Data, and its potentials ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Or is it simply because it seemed too complex or technical to bring
>>>>>> it up on this specific list ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I know some of us are working on Linked Data applications,
>>>>>> including in support of Sharing Economy applications.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I personally have been interested in some of its applications for a
>>>>>> few years, without being a programmer.  I collaborated with a programmer
>>>>>> over the last years, to explore some of the approaches that can be taken to
>>>>>> create certain applications.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ///
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The first aim I have with this email is to have some kind of quick ,
>>>>>> hopefully sufficiently representative set of replies.  It does not have to
>>>>>> be on the public list - you can also reply to me in private if you like.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From there on, I wish to open up another thread to further explain
>>>>>> what Linked Data can be used for with those of us who may have explored the
>>>>>> topic and may see potential in supporting such research as to manifest them
>>>>>> into certain applications, in support of , for example, p2p commons
>>>>>> oriented political economies.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cordially,
>>>>>> Dante
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------
>>>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:56 AM
>>>>>> To: Connor Turland <connorturland at gmail.com>, Bob Haugen <
>>>>>> bob.haugen at gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <ishanshapiro at gmail.com>,
>>>>>> Benjamin Brownell <solaureum at gmail.com>, Arthur Brock <
>>>>>> artbrock at geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun <eric at harris-braun.com>, "
>>>>>> me at larky.org" <me at larky.org>, elf Pavlik <
>>>>>> perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenesist at gmail.com>, S
>>>>>> H <seh999 at gmail.com>, Helene Finidori <hfinidori at gmail.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> sent this to p2pf list ...
>>>>>> Cordially, Dante
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------
>>>>>> From: *Helene Finidori* <hfinidori at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 9:33 AM
>>>>>> To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Cc: Connor Turland <connorturland at gmail.com>, Bob Haugen <
>>>>>> bob.haugen at gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <ishanshapiro at gmail.com>,
>>>>>> Benjamin Brownell <solaureum at gmail.com>, Arthur Brock <
>>>>>> artbrock at geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun <eric at harris-braun.com>, "
>>>>>> me at larky.org" <me at larky.org>, elf Pavlik <
>>>>>> perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenesist at gmail.com>, S
>>>>>> H <seh999 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Good idea.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Wasn't this what we were trying to do at the Ouishare labs camp last
>>>>>> May? Find ways to de-silo-ize the web, enable interoperability and info to
>>>>>> 'find each other' based on people's (agent's') intentions and capacities?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It would indeed be interesting to 'package' the 'value proposition' a
>>>>>> bit :) in a compact and direct 'aha that's what I could use it for , or
>>>>>> that's how it could concretely benefit society' generating way. And yes,
>>>>>> create a collective...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------
>>>>>> From: *Bob Haugen* <bob.haugen at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 10:03 AM
>>>>>> To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Cc: Connor Turland <connorturland at gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <
>>>>>> ishanshapiro at gmail.com>, Benjamin Brownell <solaureum at gmail.com>,
>>>>>> Arthur Brock <artbrock at geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun <
>>>>>> eric at harris-braun.com>, "me at larky.org" <me at larky.org>, elf Pavlik <
>>>>>> perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenesist at gmail.com>, S
>>>>>> H <seh999 at gmail.com>, Helene Finidori <hfinidori at gmail.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We are doing some of what Linked Data requires: providing
>>>>>> derefenceable URIs for all objects. Most have them now; all will have
>>>>>> them eventually.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We are not currently using or investigating RDF. We are starting to
>>>>>> offer JSON as a serialization format, which so far is the only format
>>>>>> that has been requested.  Would happily learn and use RDF if needed.
>>>>>> We also plan to offer value streams (like activity streams but of
>>>>>> value-creating and using activities).  The pace of offerings depends
>>>>>> on somebody wanting to use them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------
>>>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 4:35 PM
>>>>>> To: Helene Finidori <hfinidori at gmail.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ... while at the same time enabling people to understand that this is
>>>>>> a research project,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> that we do not have ready products, and that people are invited to
>>>>>> contribute to make such visions into reality...   including via their own
>>>>>> projects,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> using standardized modules and/or offering frameworks people can
>>>>>> re-use for their own purposes...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> P2P Foundation - Mailing list
>>>> http://www.p2pfoundation.net
>>>> https://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net
>>
>> <http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation>Updates:
>> http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens
>>
>> #82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/
>>
>
>
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