[P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !

Dante-Gabryell Monson dante.monson at gmail.com
Tue Dec 24 11:56:33 CET 2013


Hi Brent,

there is some convergence happening via

http://bwcd.vdcn.org/doku.php

*" Let's get some cool people together and live in a tribe / family / team
/ intentional community. Experiment with better ways to live, and make the
world a cooler place. We'll work together to survive and look after each
other. "*

Email :

http://bwcd.vdcn.org/doku.php/email_list

///

Further approaches can be discussed there ?





On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Michel Bauwens
<michel at p2pfoundation.net>wrote:

> hi Brent, I have aggregated the wide variety of open business models at
> http://p2pfoundation.net/Category:Business_Models
>
> not only are there solutions, but there are plenty of solutions, the key
> question is of course finding the one that fits with your particular
> project ...
>
> but the general scheme, building a community around a commons, and create
> a market entity around it (such as a coop), works well
>
> Michel
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 10:59 PM, Brent Shambaugh <
> brent.shambaugh at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> Since around mid-march or so I've spent time trying to refining the ideas
>> from my Distributed Economy blog (
>> http://www.adistributedeconomy.blogspot.com/) into a proposal. I kind of
>> felt like I was teaching myself all of computer science. Even though I felt
>> I was learning quite a bit, it came at a considerable cost to myself. It is
>> hard to think in a peer-to-peer fashion while questioning the fabric of
>> academia and industry. I felt that I did not fit in anywhere and was unsure
>> build a business model around it. Physically, it seemed that way too. I
>> also became very cynical. I grew isolated, but thought I needed time for
>> self-study so what I was writing was credible, competitive and lucid enough
>> that I could put faith in it to be confident with others. Still, it's scope
>> was huge, enough to be not taken seriously by itself I guess. I felt I
>> basically was trying to change the operating system of the planet, and
>> everything else was built on top of that (businesses, academia, etc...).
>> Was the value network the business model? That, and maybe support? Do I
>> just try to start something like Linux and hope for the best? That's the
>> sort of scale I was envisioning. Fortunately, the web efforts have done a
>> lot of the groundwork. It's more of a use then. It's hard to say I did much
>> beyond understanding and some aggregation of connections that others might
>> not have seen. People tell you to hold on to some things in private, while
>> at the same time you want to integrate with the rest of the community.
>> Maybe what I have is significant, maybe it is not. It would be great to
>> share it. I believe enough in it to think it could help people. I'm almost
>> done with what seems to resemble a 20 page outline. I do not want to
>> fragment the community (or be fragmented from it), but at the same time I
>> need some sustainable way to survive. Paradoxically, it seems it needs the
>> support and the efforts and the ideas of the community to succeed. Are
>> there any solutions? I'm sorry if I come off as arrogant in any way.
>>
>> -Brent
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 11:50 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson <
>> dante.monson at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Eric
>>>
>>> Yes, I'd be glad to follow up on the thinking and research you are doing
>>> around metacurrency, and participate in the scheduled hang out.
>>>
>>> further note :
>>> an interesting reply by June on this thread,
>>> also available on the public p2pf list archive
>>>
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/
>>>
>>>
>>>    - [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is
>>>    understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg01085.html>
>>>     Dante-Gabryell Monson
>>>       - Re: [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is
>>>       understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg01087.html>
>>>        June Gorman
>>>       - Re: [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is
>>>       understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg01088.html>
>>>        Dante-Gabryell Monson
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:43 PM, Eric Harris-Braun <eric at harris-braun.com
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi All,
>>>>
>>>> It turns out that where the technical side of the MetaCurrency Project
>>>> has led us has lots to do with Semantic Data or rather, from our point of
>>>> view, Semantic Computing.  Ceptr, the computing stack we are designing to
>>>> build our tools out of, pushes Semantics down into the lowest levels of the
>>>> stack, in a way that we haven't seen with the approaches inherent embodied
>>>> in RDF/URI.
>>>>
>>>> For folks interested in our approach, I'm scheduling a tech hang-out in
>>>> the next week or two. If you want to be notified of it please drop me a
>>>> line.
>>>>
>>>> -Eric
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 11:51 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson <
>>>> dante.monson at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> *pre-note : I try to understand if we can , possibly collectively, *
>>>>> *write an article that could be published on the p2pfoundation blog,*
>>>>> *as to better explain, in words and with images / graphics , *
>>>>> *some of the potentials of building on, for example, Linked Data -
>>>>> and/or similar technologies enabling us to more easily redefine our
>>>>> realities collectively -*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *If anyone wrote on these topics, or is interested in combining our
>>>>> efforts and research in writing about these topics, or if some can help in
>>>>> making such article in a enjoyable reading moment ( combining it with nice
>>>>> imagery and stories ? Like some science fiction authors manage to do - yet
>>>>> talking about the present ? ) it would be great.   I mean, not only about
>>>>> one specific application or project, but about the potential to work
>>>>> together on various applications based on common protocols. *
>>>>>
>>>>> *Some call it a "Global Brain" , or a "Web Operating System" , ... *
>>>>>
>>>>> *Below is what I want to say to open up the topics for now ... I am
>>>>> open to brainstorm further, and progressively collectively organize an
>>>>> easier to understand blog post, or series of blog posts, on such topics.*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks Bob, Thanks Helene,
>>>>>
>>>>> for your replies.
>>>>>
>>>>> I sent this message initially motivated by the realization, after an
>>>>> email exchange with Michel.
>>>>>
>>>>> Michel pointed that in his view there seemed to be little interest
>>>>> regarding Linked Data / Semantic Web approaches on p2pf related forums.
>>>>>
>>>>> So I wondered if this was really the case, and if so, what could be
>>>>> the reason,
>>>>> and how could it be better communicated.
>>>>>
>>>>> Possibly showing how different projects may have an interest in using
>>>>> such technologies in their research and development of applications,
>>>>> showing overlap of different applications that want to embody such
>>>>> technologies,
>>>>> and overlap and re-use of the data generated by each of these
>>>>> applications to enable yet new applications.
>>>>>
>>>>> For example, Bob in collaboration with Sensorica for Open Value
>>>>> Network tools...
>>>>>
>>>>> Although the technologies can be re-used and adapted for a variety of
>>>>> applications,
>>>>> hence Netention ( mostly Seth coding for now ) researching approaches,
>>>>> and inviting others into such research and development, which hopefully can
>>>>> be re-used for Open Value Networks, or for alternative forms of learning
>>>>> building on available information on our wiki's , etc
>>>>>
>>>>> Other projects, such as metamaps, are also interested ( or already
>>>>> including ) such approaches ...
>>>>>
>>>>> Pavlik was already talking about FOAF ( one aspect / approach using
>>>>> Linked Data concepts ) many years ago.  I now notice Pavlik is regaining
>>>>> interest, including in Schema and Json , ... midst others, in support of
>>>>> Sharing Economy applications ?
>>>>>
>>>>> ///
>>>>>
>>>>> But in a larger sense, I feel it is about contributing to the
>>>>> development of remedies regarding Anoptism ( which Olivier talks about ,
>>>>> http://p2pfoundation.net/Anoptism , while facilitating at first
>>>>> Holoptism )
>>>>>
>>>>> In the understanding which I developed by interacting with Seth and
>>>>> others via lists such as "Global Survival List"<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/global-survival>
>>>>> ,
>>>>>
>>>>> such Web 3.0 approaches get us closer to the concept of " Noosphere "
>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noosphere
>>>>>
>>>>> Or should I be already speaking of Web 4.0 , since I can notice a
>>>>> convergence with artificial intelligence.
>>>>>
>>>>> See :
>>>>>
>>>>> http://novaspivack.typepad.com/RadarNetworksTowardsAWebOS.jpg
>>>>> ( and another graph about internet evolution
>>>>> http://www.didael.it/sito/evoluzione_web.htm  , also calling some
>>>>> phases we have technologies for and for which we need more collaboration in
>>>>> research to reduce the threshold for its usage , "the metaweb"
>>>>> http://koolaidantidote.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/metaweb_graph.gif )
>>>>>
>>>>> Emergent Collective Consciousness, Approaches to Collective
>>>>> Intelligence, to Emergent forms of Networked Political Economies, ...
>>>>>
>>>>> and can be combined with , for example, understanding in the field of
>>>>> Artificial Intelligence. ( could be interesting to refer to the Global
>>>>> Brain Institute ? http://globalbraininstitute.org/ )
>>>>>
>>>>> There are so many implications regarding decision making,
>>>>> collaboration and collective intelligence, learning, resource allocation ,
>>>>> and even finance...
>>>>>
>>>>> I see a lot of parallels between the potentials of Linked Data
>>>>> approaches,
>>>>> and the spirit of the Meta Currency project.
>>>>>
>>>>> Although there are indeed different potential approaches and
>>>>> technologies,
>>>>> and hopefully we can choose inter-operable ones.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are series of existing Ontologies.  RDF Schema being one
>>>>> approach which seems to be receiving wider acceptance.
>>>>> There is also the use of Json.
>>>>>
>>>>> Then there is the potential combination between Folksonomies and
>>>>> Ontologies, into Folksontologies...    And I did not even mention other
>>>>> interesting approaches ( slightly different then the W3C approach ? ) ,
>>>>> such as that of Pierre Levy
>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_L%C3%A9vy and IEML
>>>>> http://p2pfoundation.net/Information_Economy_Meta_Language
>>>>>
>>>>> At least in spirit, in my understanding of it. - for each application,
>>>>> various combinations of technologies may been considered,
>>>>>
>>>>> yet I see potential in enabling inter-operable formats, and data that
>>>>> can be re-used along compatible data graph approaches...
>>>>>
>>>>> How can this best be explained with imagery that anyone could
>>>>> understand,
>>>>> and beyond any one specific project ?   Enable the imagery of a new
>>>>> way of creating and using data... re-using such data, enabling us to
>>>>> contextualize and choose the ( political and economic ) "games" we play
>>>>> based on such contextualization layers ?
>>>>>
>>>>> Enabling us to interact with others, and across various applications,
>>>>> beyond any proprietary approaches, and beyond any social silos...
>>>>>
>>>>> Yet at the same time, enabling "machines" to understand ...
>>>>>
>>>>> Opening up whole new dimensions in terms of what seems to be widely
>>>>> called "The Internet of Things"<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_of_Things> /
>>>>> Spimes <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spime> , including in support of
>>>>> the Sharing Economy, or better still in my view, A Contribution Economy
>>>>> based on Peer Production in support of the Commons.
>>>>>
>>>>> That this can be enabled by experimenting further with various
>>>>> existing modules and protocols... reducing threshold for their usage,
>>>>> reducing the threshold for generating data together, reducing the threshold
>>>>> for organizing ourselves using such data ...
>>>>>
>>>>> There are many more themes this relates to.
>>>>>
>>>>> For example, Architecture - Urbanism, etc
>>>>> ( such as Modular Parametric Design , based on Lego Like components
>>>>> that can easily be re-assembled ? )
>>>>>
>>>>> There are also many risks - and in my view, a need to think how we can
>>>>> be ahead of understanding the technology, to avoid it being used to trap us
>>>>> in it - and instead use it to liberate and empower us.
>>>>>
>>>>> Please feel free to correct me where you see fit, complement views,
>>>>> give your own perceptions, etc
>>>>>
>>>>> There is existing code from various projects for such kind of "Web
>>>>> 4.0" browsing - there has been already a lot of research.
>>>>>
>>>>> In my view, one of the main challenges now, is to get people to work
>>>>> together on open sourced code and libre licenses,
>>>>>
>>>>> for developing inter-operable tools using such open protocols...
>>>>>
>>>>> Making the various interfaces easier to understand and use...
>>>>>
>>>>> But first, in my view, we need to see if people grasp these concepts,
>>>>> and understand that these potentials are very real and are current - and we
>>>>> can participate in their development, and hopefully soon benefit from its
>>>>> potentials.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also, there is funding available - for those of us who are good with
>>>>> funding applications - and can enable access to such larger partnerships -,
>>>>> willing to contribute to the work of programmers, or willing to motivate
>>>>> programmers to converge around a commons oriented approach -
>>>>>
>>>>> see : http://fisa.future-internet.eu/index.php/FIA_Research_Roadmap
>>>>>
>>>>> http://cordis.europa.eu/fp7/ict/ssai/fp8preparations_en.html
>>>>>
>>>>> Note : There are also all kinds of existing video materials that can
>>>>> be used to illustrate such concepts...  I am willing to bring them
>>>>> together.   Those who can do video editing, I d be interested in supporting
>>>>> research for creating a new video document too, in addition to blog
>>>>> articles.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Forwarded conversation
>>>>>
>>>>> Subject: Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is
>>>>> understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !
>>>>>  ------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:50 AM
>>>>> To: p2p-foundation <p2p-foundation at lists.ourproject.org>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> What would be your answer ? ( reply on this list or in private to me )
>>>>>
>>>>> *A ) Interested in ( getting to know more about ) its potentials*
>>>>> *B ) Not interested*
>>>>>
>>>>> and
>>>>>
>>>>> *1 ) Never heard of Linked Data
>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data>*
>>>>> *2 ) Know about it*
>>>>> *3 ) Actively researching Linked Data
>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data> applications ( in support of p2p
>>>>> 4 commons ? )*
>>>>>
>>>>> ( or whatever other replies you wish to give )
>>>>>
>>>>> //
>>>>>
>>>>> Context of my question :
>>>>>
>>>>> Michel noted that in his view Linked Data has not been a topic with
>>>>> much interest on the p2pf related forums.
>>>>>
>>>>> I wish to understand if this is simply because not many of us know
>>>>> about Linked Data, and its potentials ?
>>>>>
>>>>> Or is it simply because it seemed too complex or technical to bring it
>>>>> up on this specific list ?
>>>>>
>>>>> I know some of us are working on Linked Data applications,
>>>>> including in support of Sharing Economy applications.
>>>>>
>>>>> I personally have been interested in some of its applications for a
>>>>> few years, without being a programmer.  I collaborated with a programmer
>>>>> over the last years, to explore some of the approaches that can be taken to
>>>>> create certain applications.
>>>>>
>>>>> ///
>>>>>
>>>>> The first aim I have with this email is to have some kind of quick ,
>>>>> hopefully sufficiently representative set of replies.  It does not have to
>>>>> be on the public list - you can also reply to me in private if you like.
>>>>>
>>>>> From there on, I wish to open up another thread to further explain
>>>>> what Linked Data can be used for with those of us who may have explored the
>>>>> topic and may see potential in supporting such research as to manifest them
>>>>> into certain applications, in support of , for example, p2p commons
>>>>> oriented political economies.
>>>>>
>>>>> Cordially,
>>>>> Dante
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------
>>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:56 AM
>>>>> To: Connor Turland <connorturland at gmail.com>, Bob Haugen <
>>>>> bob.haugen at gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <ishanshapiro at gmail.com>,
>>>>> Benjamin Brownell <solaureum at gmail.com>, Arthur Brock <
>>>>> artbrock at geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun <eric at harris-braun.com>, "
>>>>> me at larky.org" <me at larky.org>, elf Pavlik <
>>>>> perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenesist at gmail.com>, S
>>>>> H <seh999 at gmail.com>, Helene Finidori <hfinidori at gmail.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> sent this to p2pf list ...
>>>>> Cordially, Dante
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------
>>>>> From: *Helene Finidori* <hfinidori at gmail.com>
>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 9:33 AM
>>>>> To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>> Cc: Connor Turland <connorturland at gmail.com>, Bob Haugen <
>>>>> bob.haugen at gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <ishanshapiro at gmail.com>,
>>>>> Benjamin Brownell <solaureum at gmail.com>, Arthur Brock <
>>>>> artbrock at geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun <eric at harris-braun.com>, "
>>>>> me at larky.org" <me at larky.org>, elf Pavlik <
>>>>> perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenesist at gmail.com>, S
>>>>> H <seh999 at gmail.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Good idea.
>>>>>
>>>>> Wasn't this what we were trying to do at the Ouishare labs camp last
>>>>> May? Find ways to de-silo-ize the web, enable interoperability and info to
>>>>> 'find each other' based on people's (agent's') intentions and capacities?
>>>>>
>>>>> It would indeed be interesting to 'package' the 'value proposition' a
>>>>> bit :) in a compact and direct 'aha that's what I could use it for , or
>>>>> that's how it could concretely benefit society' generating way. And yes,
>>>>> create a collective...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------
>>>>> From: *Bob Haugen* <bob.haugen at gmail.com>
>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 10:03 AM
>>>>> To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>> Cc: Connor Turland <connorturland at gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <
>>>>> ishanshapiro at gmail.com>, Benjamin Brownell <solaureum at gmail.com>,
>>>>> Arthur Brock <artbrock at geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun <
>>>>> eric at harris-braun.com>, "me at larky.org" <me at larky.org>, elf Pavlik <
>>>>> perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenesist at gmail.com>, S
>>>>> H <seh999 at gmail.com>, Helene Finidori <hfinidori at gmail.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> We are doing some of what Linked Data requires: providing
>>>>> derefenceable URIs for all objects. Most have them now; all will have
>>>>> them eventually.
>>>>>
>>>>> We are not currently using or investigating RDF. We are starting to
>>>>> offer JSON as a serialization format, which so far is the only format
>>>>> that has been requested.  Would happily learn and use RDF if needed.
>>>>> We also plan to offer value streams (like activity streams but of
>>>>> value-creating and using activities).  The pace of offerings depends
>>>>> on somebody wanting to use them.
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------
>>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.monson at gmail.com>
>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 4:35 PM
>>>>> To: Helene Finidori <hfinidori at gmail.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ... while at the same time enabling people to understand that this is
>>>>> a research project,
>>>>>
>>>>> that we do not have ready products, and that people are invited to
>>>>> contribute to make such visions into reality...   including via their own
>>>>> projects,
>>>>>
>>>>> using standardized modules and/or offering frameworks people can
>>>>> re-use for their own purposes...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> P2P Foundation - Mailing list
>>> http://www.p2pfoundation.net
>>> https://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
> --
> P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net
>
> <http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation>Updates:
> http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens
>
> #82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/
>
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