No subject
Mon Dec 16 09:49:40 CET 2013
Linked Data can be used for with those of us who may have explored the
topic and may see potential in supporting such research as to manifest them
into certain applications, in support of , for example, p2p commons
oriented political economies.
Cordially,
Dante
----------
From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.monson at gmail.com>
Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:56 AM
To: Connor Turland <connorturland at gmail.com>, Bob Haugen <
bob.haugen at gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <ishanshapiro at gmail.com>, Benjamin
Brownell <solaureum at gmail.com>, Arthur Brock <artbrock at geekgene.com>, Eric
Harris-Braun <eric at harris-braun.com>, "me at larky.org" <me at larky.org>, elf
Pavlik <perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenesist at gmail.com>,
S H <seh999 at gmail.com>, Helene Finidori <hfinidori at gmail.com>
sent this to p2pf list ...
Cordially, Dante
----------
From: *Helene Finidori* <hfinidori at gmail.com>
Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 9:33 AM
To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <dante.monson at gmail.com>
Cc: Connor Turland <connorturland at gmail.com>, Bob Haugen <
bob.haugen at gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <ishanshapiro at gmail.com>, Benjamin
Brownell <solaureum at gmail.com>, Arthur Brock <artbrock at geekgene.com>, Eric
Harris-Braun <eric at harris-braun.com>, "me at larky.org" <me at larky.org>, elf
Pavlik <perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org>, Dan Robles <ingenesist at gmail.com>,
S H <seh999 at gmail.com>
Good idea.
Wasn't this what we were trying to do at the Ouishare labs camp last May?
Find ways to de-silo-ize the web, enable interoperability and info to 'find
each other' based on people's (agent's') intentions and capacities?
It would indeed be interesting to 'package' the 'value proposition' a bit
:) in a compact and direct 'aha that's what I could use it for , or that's
how it could concretely benefit society' generating way. And yes, create a
collective...
----------
From: *Bob Haugen* <bob.haugen at gmail.com>
Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 10:03 AM
To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <dante.monson at gmail.com>
Cc: Connor Turland <connorturland at gmail.com>, Ishan Shapiro <
ishanshapiro at gmail.com>, Benjamin Brownell <solaureum at gmail.com>, Arthur
Brock <artbrock at geekgene.com>, Eric Harris-Braun <eric at harris-braun.com>, "
me at larky.org" <me at larky.org>, elf Pavlik <perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org>,
Dan Robles <ingenesist at gmail.com>, S H <seh999 at gmail.com>, Helene Finidori <
hfinidori at gmail.com>
We are doing some of what Linked Data requires: providing
derefenceable URIs for all objects. Most have them now; all will have
them eventually.
We are not currently using or investigating RDF. We are starting to
offer JSON as a serialization format, which so far is the only format
that has been requested. Would happily learn and use RDF if needed.
We also plan to offer value streams (like activity streams but of
value-creating and using activities). The pace of offerings depends
on somebody wanting to use them.
----------
From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <dante.monson at gmail.com>
Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 4:35 PM
To: Helene Finidori <hfinidori at gmail.com>
... while at the same time enabling people to understand that this is a
research project,
that we do not have ready products, and that people are invited to
contribute to make such visions into reality... including via their own
projects,
using standardized modules and/or offering frameworks people can re-use for
their own purposes...
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><i><b>pre-note :=A0I try to understand if we can , po=
ssibly collectively,=A0</b></i></div><div><i><b>write an article that could=
be published on the p2pfoundation blog,</b></i></div><div><i><b>as to bett=
er explain, in words and with images / graphics ,=A0</b></i></div>
<div><i><b>some of the potentials of building on, for example, Linked Data =
- and/or similar technologies enabling us to more easily redefine our reali=
ties collectively -</b></i></div><div><i><b><br></b></i></div><div><b><i>If=
anyone wrote on these topics, or is interested in combining our efforts an=
d research in writing about these topics, or if some can help in making suc=
h article in a enjoyable reading moment ( combining it with nice imagery an=
d stories ? Like some science fiction authors manage to do - yet talking ab=
out the present ? ) it would be great. =A0 I mean, not only about one speci=
fic application or project, but about the potential to work together on var=
ious applications based on common protocols.</i><i><br>
</i></b></div><div><i><b><br></b></i></div><div><i><b>Some call it a "=
Global Brain" , or a "Web Operating System" , ...=A0</b></i>=
</div><div><i><b><br></b></i></div><div><i><b>Below is what I want to say t=
o open up the topics for now ... I am open to brainstorm further, and progr=
essively collectively organize an easier to understand blog post, or series=
of blog posts, on such topics.</b></i></div>
<div><br></div><div><br></div><br>Thanks Bob, Thanks Helene,<div><br></div>=
<div>for your replies.</div><div><br></div><div>I sent this message initial=
ly motivated by the realization, after an email exchange with Michel.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Michel pointed that in his view there seemed to be litt=
le interest regarding Linked Data / Semantic Web approaches on p2pf related=
forums.</div><div><br></div><div>So I wondered if this was really the case=
, and if so, what could be the reason,</div>
<div>and how could it be better communicated.</div><div><br></div><div>Poss=
ibly showing how different projects may have an interest in using such tech=
nologies in their research and development of applications,</div><div>showi=
ng overlap of different applications that want to embody such technologies,=
</div>
<div>and overlap and re-use of the data generated by each of these applicat=
ions to enable yet new applications.</div><div><br></div><div>For example, =
Bob in collaboration with Sensorica for Open Value Network tools...=A0</div=
>
<div><br></div><div>Although the technologies can be re-used and adapted fo=
r a variety of applications,</div><div>hence Netention ( mostly Seth coding=
for now ) researching approaches, and inviting others into such research a=
nd development, which hopefully can be re-used for Open Value Networks, or =
for alternative forms of learning building on available information on our =
wiki's , etc</div>
<div><br></div><div>Other projects, such as metamaps, are also interested (=
or already including ) such approaches ...=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Pav=
lik was already talking about FOAF ( one aspect / approach using Linked Dat=
a concepts ) many years ago. =A0I now notice Pavlik is regaining interest, =
including in Schema and Json , ... midst others, in support of Sharing Econ=
omy applications ?</div>
<div><br></div><div>///</div><div><br></div><div>But in a larger sense, I f=
eel it is about contributing to the development of remedies regarding Anopt=
ism ( which Olivier talks about , =A0<a href=3D"http://p2pfoundation.net/An=
optism">http://p2pfoundation.net/Anoptism</a>=A0, while facilitating at fir=
st Holoptism )</div>
<div><br></div><div>In the understanding which I developed by interacting w=
ith Seth and others via lists such as <a href=3D"https://groups.google.com/=
forum/#!forum/global-survival">"Global Survival List"</a>,</div>
<div><br></div><div>such Web 3.0 approaches get us closer to the concept of=
" Noosphere "=A0</div><div><a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/wi=
ki/Noosphere">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noosphere</a><br></div><div><br>
</div><div>Or should I be already speaking of Web 4.0 , since I can notice =
a convergence with artificial intelligence.</div><div><br></div><div>See :<=
/div><div><br></div><div><a href=3D"http://novaspivack.typepad.com/RadarNet=
worksTowardsAWebOS.jpg">http://novaspivack.typepad.com/RadarNetworksTowards=
AWebOS.jpg</a><br>
</div><div>( and another graph about internet evolution=A0</div><div><a hre=
f=3D"http://www.didael.it/sito/evoluzione_web.htm">http://www.didael.it/sit=
o/evoluzione_web.htm</a>=A0 , also calling some phases we have technologies=
for and for which we need more collaboration in research to reduce the thr=
eshold for its usage , "the metaweb"=A0<a href=3D"http://koolaida=
ntidote.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/metaweb_graph.gif">http://koolaidantido=
te.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/metaweb_graph.gif</a>=A0)<br>
</div><div><br></div><div>Emergent Collective Consciousness, Approaches to =
Collective Intelligence, to Emergent forms of Networked Political Economies=
, ...=A0</div><div><br></div><div>and can be combined with , for example, u=
nderstanding in the field of Artificial Intelligence. ( could be interestin=
g to refer to the Global Brain Institute ?=A0<a href=3D"http://globalbraini=
nstitute.org/">http://globalbraininstitute.org/</a>=A0)</div>
<div><br></div><div>There are so many implications regarding decision makin=
g, collaboration and collective intelligence, learning, resource allocation=
, and even finance...</div><div><br></div><div>I see a lot of parallels be=
tween the potentials of Linked Data approaches,</div>
<div>and the spirit of the Meta Currency project.</div><div><br></div><div>=
Although there are indeed different potential approaches and technologies,<=
/div><div>and hopefully we can choose inter-operable ones.</div><div><br>
</div><div>There are series of existing Ontologies. =A0RDF Schema being one=
approach which seems to be receiving wider acceptance.</div><div>There is =
also the use of Json.=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Then there is the potenti=
al combination between Folksonomies and Ontologies, into Folksontologies...=
=A0 =A0And I did not even mention other interesting approaches ( slightly =
different then the W3C approach ? ) , such as that of Pierre Levy</div>
<div><a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_L%C3%A9vy">http://en.wi=
kipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_L%C3%A9vy</a>=A0and IEML=A0<a href=3D"http://p2pfou=
ndation.net/Information_Economy_Meta_Language">http://p2pfoundation.net/Inf=
ormation_Economy_Meta_Language</a><br>
</div><div><br></div><div>At least in spirit, in my understanding of it. - =
for each application, various combinations of technologies may been conside=
red,</div><div><br></div><div>yet I see potential in enabling inter-operabl=
e formats, and data that can be re-used along compatible data graph approac=
hes...=A0</div>
<div><br></div><div>How can this best be explained with imagery that anyone=
could understand,</div><div>and beyond any one specific project ? =A0 Enab=
le the imagery of a new way of creating and using data... re-using such dat=
a, enabling us to contextualize and choose the ( political and economic ) &=
quot;games" we play based on such contextualization layers ?</div>
<div><br></div><div>Enabling us to interact with others, and across various=
applications, beyond any proprietary approaches, and beyond any social sil=
os...=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Yet at the same time, enabling "mach=
ines" to understand ...=A0</div>
<div><br></div><div>Opening up whole new dimensions in terms of what seems =
to be widely called <a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_of_Thi=
ngs">"The Internet of Things"</a>=A0/ <a href=3D"http://en.wikipe=
dia.org/wiki/Spime">Spimes</a>=A0, including in support of the Sharing Econ=
omy, or better still in my view, A Contribution Economy based on Peer Produ=
ction in support of the Commons.</div>
<div><br></div><div>That this can be enabled by experimenting further with =
various existing modules and protocols... reducing threshold for their usag=
e, reducing the threshold for generating data together, reducing the thresh=
old for organizing ourselves using such data ...=A0</div>
<div><br></div><div>There are many more themes this relates to.</div><div><=
br></div><div>For example, Architecture - Urbanism, etc</div><div>( such as=
Modular Parametric Design , based on Lego Like components that can easily =
be re-assembled ? )</div>
<div><br></div><div>There are also many risks - and in my view, a need to t=
hink how we can be ahead of understanding the technology, to avoid it being=
used to trap us in it - and instead use it to liberate and empower us.</di=
v>
<div><br></div><div>Please feel free to correct me where you see fit, compl=
ement views, give your own perceptions, etc</div><div><br></div><div>There =
is existing code from various projects for such kind of "Web 4.0"=
browsing - there has been already a lot of research.</div>
<div><br></div><div>In my view, one of the main challenges now, is to get p=
eople to work together on open sourced code and libre licenses,</div><div><=
br></div><div>for developing inter-operable tools using such open protocols=
...=A0</div>
<div><br></div><div>Making the various interfaces easier to understand and =
use...=A0</div><div><br></div><div>But first, in my view, we need to see if=
people grasp these concepts, and understand that these potentials are very=
real and are current - and we can participate in their development, and ho=
pefully soon benefit from its potentials.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Also, there is funding available - for those of us who =
are good with funding applications - and can enable access to such larger p=
artnerships -, willing to contribute to the work of programmers, or willing=
to motivate programmers to converge around a commons oriented approach -</=
div>
<div><br><div style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">see :=
=A0<a href=3D"http://fisa.future-internet.eu/index.php/FIA_Research_Roadmap=
" target=3D"_blank">http://fisa.future-internet.eu/index.php/FIA_Research_R=
oadmap</a></div>
<div style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br></div><div s=
tyle=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><a href=3D"http://cord=
is.europa.eu/fp7/ict/ssai/fp8preparations_en.html" target=3D"_blank">http:/=
/cordis.europa.eu/fp7/ict/ssai/fp8preparations_en.html</a></div>
</div><div style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br></div>=
<div style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">Note : There are=
also all kinds of existing video materials that can be used to illustrate =
such concepts... =A0I am willing to bring them together. =A0 Those who can =
do video editing, I d be interested in supporting research for creating a n=
ew video document too, in addition to blog articles.</div>
<div><br></div><div><br><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><span style=3D"f=
ont-size:large;font-weight:bold">Forwarded conversation</span><br>Subject: =
<b class=3D"gmail_sendername">Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interes=
ted is understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks !</b><br>
------------------------<br><br><span class=3D""><font color=3D"#888">From:=
<b class=3D"">Dante-Gabryell Monson</b> <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"m=
ailto:dante.monson at gmail.com">dante.monson at gmail.com</a>></span><br>Date=
: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:50 AM<br>
To: p2p-foundation <<a href=3D"mailto:p2p-foundation at lists.ourproject.or=
g">p2p-foundation at lists.ourproject.org</a>><br></font><br></span><br><di=
v dir=3D"ltr"><div>What would be your answer ? ( reply on this list or in p=
rivate to me )<br>
</div><div><br></div><div><b>A ) Interested in ( getting to know more about=
) its potentials</b></div><div><b>B ) Not interested</b></div>
<div><br></div><div>and</div><div><br></div><div><b>1 ) Never heard of <a h=
ref=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data" target=3D"_blank">Linked D=
ata</a></b></div><div><b>2 ) Know about it</b></div><div><b>3 ) Actively re=
searching <a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data" target=3D"_b=
lank">Linked Data</a> applications ( in support of p2p 4 commons ? )</b><br=
>
</div><div><br></div><div>( or whatever other replies you wish to give )</d=
iv><div><br></div><div>//</div><div><br></div><div>Context of my question :=
</div><div><br></div><div>Michel noted that in his view Linked Data has not=
been a topic with much interest on the p2pf related forums.<br>
</div><div><br></div><div>I wish to understand if this is simply because no=
t many of us know about Linked Data, and its potentials ?</div><div><br></d=
iv><div>Or is it simply because it seemed too complex or technical to bring=
it up on this specific list ?</div>
<div><br></div><div>I know some of us are working on Linked Data applicatio=
ns,</div><div>including in support of Sharing Economy applications.</div><d=
iv><br></div><div>I personally have been interested in some of its applicat=
ions for a few years, without being a programmer. =A0I collaborated with a =
programmer over the last years, to explore some of the approaches that can =
be taken to create certain applications.</div>
<div><br></div><div>///</div><div><br></div><div>The first aim I have with =
this email is to have some kind of quick , hopefully sufficiently represent=
ative set of replies. =A0It does not have to be on the public list - you ca=
n also reply to me in private if you like.</div>
<div><br></div><div>From there on, I wish to open up another thread to furt=
her explain what Linked Data can be used for with those of us who may have =
explored the topic and may see potential in supporting such research as to =
manifest them into certain applications, in support of , for example, p2p c=
ommons oriented political economies.=A0</div>
<div><br></div><div>Cordially,</div><div>Dante</div><div><br></div><div><br=
></div></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div></div></div>
<br>----------<br><span class=3D""><font color=3D"#888">From: <b class=3D""=
>Dante-Gabryell Monson</b> <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:dante.mo=
nson at gmail.com">dante.monson at gmail.com</a>></span><br>Date: Mon, Dec 9, =
2013 at 6:56 AM<br>
To: Connor Turland <<a href=3D"mailto:connorturland at gmail.com">connortur=
land at gmail.com</a>>, Bob Haugen <<a href=3D"mailto:bob.haugen at gmail.c=
om">bob.haugen at gmail.com</a>>, Ishan Shapiro <<a href=3D"mailto:ishan=
shapiro at gmail.com">ishanshapiro at gmail.com</a>>, Benjamin Brownell <<a=
href=3D"mailto:solaureum at gmail.com">solaureum at gmail.com</a>>, Arthur Br=
ock <<a href=3D"mailto:artbrock at geekgene.com">artbrock at geekgene.com</a>&=
gt;, Eric Harris-Braun <<a href=3D"mailto:eric at harris-braun.com">eric at ha=
rris-braun.com</a>>, "<a href=3D"mailto:me at larky.org">me at larky.org<=
/a>" <<a href=3D"mailto:me at larky.org">me at larky.org</a>>, elf Pav=
lik <<a href=3D"mailto:perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org">perpetual-tripper@=
wwelves.org</a>>, Dan Robles <<a href=3D"mailto:ingenesist at gmail.com"=
>ingenesist at gmail.com</a>>, S H <<a href=3D"mailto:seh999 at gmail.com">=
seh999 at gmail.com</a>>, Helene Finidori <<a href=3D"mailto:hfinidori at g=
mail.com">hfinidori at gmail.com</a>><br>
</font><br></span><br><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div =
dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"im">sent this to p2pf list ...=A0</div><div><div>=
Cordially, Dante<div></div></div></div></div>
</div><br></div>
<br>----------<br><span class=3D""><font color=3D"#888">From: <b class=3D""=
>Helene Finidori</b> <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:hfinidori at gmai=
l.com">hfinidori at gmail.com</a>></span><br>Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 9:33=
AM<br>
To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <<a href=3D"mailto:dante.monson at gmail.com">dan=
te.monson at gmail.com</a>><br>Cc: Connor Turland <<a href=3D"mailto:con=
norturland at gmail.com">connorturland at gmail.com</a>>, Bob Haugen <<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:bob.haugen at gmail.com">bob.haugen at gmail.com</a>>, Ishan Shap=
iro <<a href=3D"mailto:ishanshapiro at gmail.com">ishanshapiro at gmail.com</a=
>>, Benjamin Brownell <<a href=3D"mailto:solaureum at gmail.com">solaure=
um at gmail.com</a>>, Arthur Brock <<a href=3D"mailto:artbrock at geekgene.=
com">artbrock at geekgene.com</a>>, Eric Harris-Braun <<a href=3D"mailto=
:eric at harris-braun.com">eric at harris-braun.com</a>>, "<a href=3D"mai=
lto:me at larky.org">me at larky.org</a>" <<a href=3D"mailto:me at larky.org=
">me at larky.org</a>>, elf Pavlik <<a href=3D"mailto:perpetual-tripper@=
wwelves.org">perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org</a>>, Dan Robles <<a href=
=3D"mailto:ingenesist at gmail.com">ingenesist at gmail.com</a>>, S H <<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:seh999 at gmail.com">seh999 at gmail.com</a>><br>
</font><br></span><br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>Good idea.<br><br></d=
iv>Wasn't this what we were trying to do at the Ouishare labs camp last=
May? Find ways to de-silo-ize the web, enable interoperability and info to=
'find each other' based on people's (agent's') intenti=
ons and capacities?<br>
<br></div>It would indeed be interesting to 'package' the 'valu=
e proposition' a bit :) in a compact and direct 'aha that's wha=
t I could use it for , or that's how it could concretely benefit societ=
y' generating way. And yes, create a collective...<br>
<br></div><br></div><div class=3D""></div><br>----------<br><span class=3D"=
"><font color=3D"#888">From: <b class=3D"">Bob Haugen</b> <span dir=3D"ltr"=
><<a href=3D"mailto:bob.haugen at gmail.com">bob.haugen at gmail.com</a>></=
span><br>
Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 10:03 AM<br>To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <<a href=
=3D"mailto:dante.monson at gmail.com">dante.monson at gmail.com</a>><br>Cc: Co=
nnor Turland <<a href=3D"mailto:connorturland at gmail.com">connorturland at g=
mail.com</a>>, Ishan Shapiro <<a href=3D"mailto:ishanshapiro at gmail.co=
m">ishanshapiro at gmail.com</a>>, Benjamin Brownell <<a href=3D"mailto:=
solaureum at gmail.com">solaureum at gmail.com</a>>, Arthur Brock <<a href=
=3D"mailto:artbrock at geekgene.com">artbrock at geekgene.com</a>>, Eric Harri=
s-Braun <<a href=3D"mailto:eric at harris-braun.com">eric at harris-braun.com<=
/a>>, "<a href=3D"mailto:me at larky.org">me at larky.org</a>" <<=
a href=3D"mailto:me at larky.org">me at larky.org</a>>, elf Pavlik <<a href=
=3D"mailto:perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org">perpetual-tripper at wwelves.org</a>=
>, Dan Robles <<a href=3D"mailto:ingenesist at gmail.com">ingenesist at gma=
il.com</a>>, S H <<a href=3D"mailto:seh999 at gmail.com">seh999 at gmail.co=
m</a>>, Helene Finidori <<a href=3D"mailto:hfinidori at gmail.com">hfini=
dori at gmail.com</a>><br>
</font><br></span><br>We are doing some of what Linked Data requires: provi=
ding<br>
derefenceable URIs for all objects. Most have them now; all will have<br>
them eventually.<br>
<br>
We are not currently using or investigating RDF. We are starting to<br>
offer JSON as a serialization format, which so far is the only format<br>
that has been requested. =A0Would happily learn and use RDF if needed.<br>
We also plan to offer value streams (like activity streams but of<br>
value-creating and using activities). =A0The pace of offerings depends<br>
on somebody wanting to use them.<br>
<div class=3D""></div><br>----------<br><span class=3D""><font color=3D"#88=
8">From: <b class=3D"">Dante-Gabryell Monson</b> <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:dante.monson at gmail.com">dante.monson at gmail.com</a>></span>=
<br>Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 4:35 PM<br>
To: Helene Finidori <<a href=3D"mailto:hfinidori at gmail.com">hfinidori at gm=
ail.com</a>><br></font><br></span><br><div dir=3D"ltr">... while at the =
same time enabling people to understand that this is a research project,<di=
v>
<br></div><div>that we do not have ready products, and that people are invi=
ted to contribute to make such visions into reality... =A0 including via th=
eir own projects,</div>
<div><br></div><div>using standardized modules and/or offering frameworks p=
eople can re-use for their own purposes...=A0</div></div><div class=3D""></=
div><br></div><br></div></div>
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