[P2P-F] Fw: [gang8] Social credit versus productive money

Thu Jun 14 19:43:12 CEST 2012

----- Forwarded Message -----
From: Arno Mong Daastoel <amd at daastol.com>
To: gang8 at yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Thursday, 14 June 2012, 13:25
Subject: [gang8] Social credit versus productive money

Hugh,

I am not sure that the West need any scheme of social credit, be it the versions of Steve Keen's, Kitson or  or Douglas.
Given the uncompetitive state, it seems to me that the West need to upgrade its productive capacity, not distribute credit for whatever purpose (such as more import). Therefore, I would rather favour this productive tradition of Hamilton, List etc.

Arno  

On 14.06.2012 11:59, Arno Mong Daastoel wrote: 
>dropping the effective tax rates
>
>
>I guess the easiest way of doing it would be to up the minimum level of income liable for tax payment.
>
>It would also have the additional effects of,
>
>1) distributing resources to the most needy
>2) making work for low wages more attractive
>3) increase competitiveness of the nation's industry
>4) increase employment
>5) increase tax revenues (counter-acting the public costs of tax relief)
>
>Arno
>
>PS
>In Norway, to my knowledge, the only party who has gone for this solution is the right wing populist party (the Progress Party)
>Left is not always right, or was it the way around?
>;-)
>
>On 12.06.2012 20:37, Hugh Whinfrey wrote: 
>There is less administrative overhead and it is generally more fair
>>if all citizens are granted the same slump sum amount. I have made
>>this proposal before in a forum where I believe Mr. Keen is familiar
>>with the posts. I would hope that the lack of ability to claim credit for 
>>being the originator of the above idea is not what is making him stick 
>>to his guns on what is clearly an unfair and uncecessarily complex 
>>proposal. 
>>
>>The IRS/Inland Revenue  can simply administer the leftover lump sum as 
>>a  whopping tax credit. That would cause a whole lot of folks to suddenly
>>decide to engage in productive economic activity where there currently
>>is no incentive to do so.  "Anti-austerity", i.e. dropping the effective tax rates
>>to allow a new private economy of small businesses to take root  is actually 
>>the only way out. The sooner we get started, the sooner it will get fixed.
>>
>>Hugh
>>
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: Arno Mong Daastoel 
>>>To: gang8 at yahoogroups.com 
>>>Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2012 9:02 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [gang8] Re: Debt - Dick Eastman versus Steve Keen
>>>
>>>Geoffrey,
>>>
>>>Here is a message for you.
>>>(Somehow it did not reach me, found it on the list's yahoo website)
>>>
>>>Arno
>>>
>>>From: John Hermann <hermann at chariot.net.au> 
>>>Date: Tue Jun 5, 2012 2:35 pm 
>>>Subject: Re: [gang8] Re: Debt - Dick Eastman versus Steve Keen 
>>>
>>>To receive the money, one would need to fill in a debt-relief application form.  And as part of the contract between you and the issuer of this public grant you would undertake (a) to list all of the debts satisfying specified criteria, eg home mortgages, credit card debt, etc., and (b) to pay off those debts up to a maximum allowed limit.  It would be effectively enforced by the tax office (the department of internal revenue), to whom all of the debt payments must be reported -- by both you and those receiving the payments.  I am well aware of some of the problems that this operation would entail, but nobody said it had to be easy. 
>>>
>>>John Hermann
>>>
>>>
>>>On 5/06/2012 9:06 PM, G W Gardiner wrote: 
>>>
>>>Wonder how one enforces it?
>>>
>>>Geoff
>>>
>>>
>>>
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