[P2P-F] Fidonet in community wireless projects?
Sascha Meinrath
meinrath at newamerica.net
Sat Mar 19 15:51:03 CET 2011
Hi all,
On 03/19/2011 12:32 AM, Gordon Cook wrote:
> in some way similar? Only in the store and forward sense of making the next
> hop. Randy bush was backbacking around south america in the 1980s doing uucp
> and then fido, dave hughes did fido with big sky telegraph, i carried a 9600
> baud modem to moscow for one of the first russian fidos.
>
> wireless mesh is MUCH faster BUT although i'd like to see it happen i doubt that
> it will ever be globally routable. sascha, do you agree or not? If anyone
> thinks it can be globally routable please tell me how.
IPv6 does allow global routability. Currently, we're working on distributed and
ad-hoc mesh routability at massive scale. I don't think we've yet found a limit
and (thus far) technological improvements have outstripped any scalability
issues, but the problem of routing overhead is one that we're constantly working
on. Meanwhile, in terms of precursors, I'd look more to ALOHAnet and the like.
Where Fidonet does have a closer parallel is in the notion of diffusion of
information -- i.e., that key info could move slowly and didn't need to suffuse
the entire network simultaneously. When my team developed HSLS (see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hazy_Sighted_Link_State_Routing_Protocol) this was
the key breakthrough (and what dramatically lowered routing overhead to make
mesh networking far more scalable. Unfortunately, I couldn't convince
developers I was working with to integrate the best-of tech from European folks,
however, I was able to convince Europeans to integrate best-of tech from us. So
today, BATMAN and olsrd are the standards -- they uses HSLS-like routing, and
the tech scales to incredibly large networks.
--Sascha
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> On Mar 18, 2011, at 6:14 PM, Sepp Hasslberger wrote:
>
>>
>> "FidoNet is a point-to-point and store-and-forward email WAN which uses modems
>> on the direct-dial telephone network. It was developed in 1984, and has over
>> 20,000 public nodes worldwide.
>>
>> "FidoNet has been owned and operated primarily by end-users and hobbyists more
>> than by computer professionals. Therefore, social and political issues arose
>> in FidoNet far faster and more seriously than might be expected by those
>> raised in other network cultures."
>>
>> ( this was written in 1992 and is
>> quoted from http://www.fidonet.org/inet92_Randy_Bush.txt )
>>
>> It would seem that there are at least some parallels, and that FidoNet,
>> although technologically quite different from what we have today, was in some
>> way a predecessor to the local mesh networks that are being established here
>> and there.
>>
>> Sepp
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mar 18, 2011, at 9:59 PM, Sascha Meinrath wrote:
>>
>>> On 03/18/2011 03:58 PM, Michael Gurstein wrote:
>>>> Why don't we ask an expert... Sascha, any comments.
>>>
>>> It's on the decline, but still alive (fidonet.org <http://fidonet.org/> I
>>> think). The
>>> decentralization is similar to some of the community LAN and wireless
>>> technologies, but I wouldn't say Fidonet was a precursor (technologically
>>> speaking). Its hayday was 1980s/90s, but the Web pretty much crushed it over
>>> time.
>>>
>>> --Sascha
>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>>
>>>> M
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> *From:* Michel Bauwens [mailto:michelsub2004 at gmail.com]
>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, March 17, 2011 11:49 PM
>>>> *To:* Michael Gurstein
>>>> *Cc:* p2p-foundation; Sepp Hasslberger; armin at easynet.co.uk
>>>> <mailto:armin at easynet.co.uk>
>>>> *Subject:* Fidonet in community wireless projects?
>>>>
>>>> Interesting question, does anyone have the answer?
>>>>
>>>> I'll relay to FAcebook,
>>>>
>>>> Michel
>>>>
>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>>>> From: *Facebook* <update+pjiidwm at facebookmail.com
>>>> <mailto:update+pjiidwm at facebookmail.com>
>>>> <mailto:update%2Bpjiidwm at facebookmail.com>>
>>>> Date: Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 8:41 AM
>>>> Subject: Lorraine Lee commented on your link.
>>>> To: Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com
>>>> <mailto:michelsub2004 at gmail.com> <mailto:michelsub2004 at gmail.com>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> facebook
>>>> <http://www.facebook.com/n/?profile.php&id=528245547&v=wall&story_fbid=202735439755014&mid=3ecb58eG1f7c632bGe0a39e0Ge&bcode=BnpORHc7&n_m=michelsub2004%40gmail.com
>>>> <http://www.facebook.com/n/?profile.php&id=528245547&v=wall&story_fbid=202735439755014&mid=3ecb58eG1f7c632bGe0a39e0Ge&bcode=BnpORHc7&n_m=michelsub2004%40gmail.com>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi Michel,
>>>> Lorraine Lee commented on your link.
>>>> Lorraine wrote: "Whatever happened to Fidonet? Is the dna of fidonet alive
>>>> in some of there community wireless projects we keep hearing about?"
>>>>
>>>> See the comment thread
>>>> <http://www.facebook.com/n/?profile.php&id=528245547&v=wall&story_fbid=202735439755014&mid=3ecb58eG1f7c632bGe0a39e0Ge&bcode=BnpORHc7&n_m=michelsub2004%40gmail.com
>>>> <http://www.facebook.com/n/?profile.php&id=528245547&v=wall&story_fbid=202735439755014&mid=3ecb58eG1f7c632bGe0a39e0Ge&bcode=BnpORHc7&n_m=michelsub2004%40gmail.com>>
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