<div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 6:40 PM, Bob Haugen <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:bob.haugen@gmail.com" target="_blank">bob.haugen@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Dear Michel,<br>
<span class=""><br>
On Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 2:44 AM, Michel Bauwens<br>
<<a href="mailto:michel@p2pfoundation.net">michel@p2pfoundation.net</a>> wrote:<br>
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 10:27 PM, Bob Haugen <<a href="mailto:bob.haugen@gmail.com">bob.haugen@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
</span><span class="">>> I'm thinking about Ackerman's ideas about "a form of socialized finance<br>
>> which would respect the autonomy of the firm." I think it might help, but I<br>
>> don't know how we would get it to happen. Which is the problem with a lot of<br>
>> "good ideas", including those of the P2PF. They would require a non-existent<br>
>> organization to take over from our present rulers. (P2PF is a bit more<br>
>> realistic than Ackerman, but still...)<br>
><br>
> I am puzzled by your point here. I think the logic is very different. The<br>
> proposal of Ackerman are a proposal for a political program that needs to<br>
> win power first, but the great majority of the proposals of the p2p<br>
> foundation are already working (it's the rule for the wiki, it has to<br>
> exist), though they may need politics to be scaled and generalize.<br>
><br>
> Of course, i have a few proposals which call for new institutions, but they<br>
> are happening as well (phyles, assemblies and chambers of the commons);<br>
> stigmergy and transparency between entrepreneurial coalitions is happening<br>
> as well<br>
><br>
> so which proposals do you mean exactly, dear Bob ?<br>
<br>
</span>Partner state, in particular.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>but this is probably the most realistic of all, since prefigurative experiences, like the very mature project in Brest, is already going on for ten years or more; and the new slate of co-cities in Italy are getting significant traction, especially Bologna</div><div><br></div><div>let's not forget we are not utopians, but seek significant and realistic shifts and especially, prefigurative experimentations</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
I agree that many of the new institutions are starting to happen, but<br>
they are weak and often disconnected from one another. But the fact<br>
that they are happening at all makes them more realistic than<br>
Ackerman's proposal or any one-swell-foop transformation. Although<br>
once the separate threads cohere, the transformation could happen<br>
fast.<br>
<span class=""><br>
> see above, if you give an expanded definition of stigmergy, which I think is<br>
> appropriate, then yes. COULD YOU PLEASE write a full article on this !! We<br>
> really need to make that argument formally as part of our mutual<br>
> coordination proposals. Can you educate us about this path forward.<br>
<br>
</span>I'll do it in conjunction with more study in relation to that other<br>
article you are working on. I need to catch up a bit on the more<br>
recent developments.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>ok super </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<span class=""><br>
> ok, to help you write that article, see:<br>
> <a href="http://p2pfoundation.net/How_Current_Supply_Chains_Can_Serve_Broader_Mutual_Coordination" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://p2pfoundation.net/How_Current_Supply_Chains_Can_Serve_Broader_Mutual_Coordination</a><br>
<br>
</span>I assume I can change the title, too?<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I changed it following your instructions on the talk page </div></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div>Check out the Commons Transition Plan here at: <a href="http://commonstransition.org" target="_blank">http://commonstransition.org</a> </div><div><br></div>P2P Foundation: <a href="http://p2pfoundation.net" target="_blank">http://p2pfoundation.net</a> - <a href="http://blog.p2pfoundation.net" target="_blank">http://blog.p2pfoundation.net</a> <br><br><a href="http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation" target="_blank"></a>Updates: <a href="http://twitter.com/mbauwens" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/mbauwens</a>; <a href="http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens" target="_blank">http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens</a><br><br>#82 on the (En)Rich list: <a href="http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/" target="_blank">http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/</a> <br></div></div></div></div>
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