<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div><span></span></div><div><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><div><span></span></div><div><div><span></span></div><div><div>I agree Anna, and also with Bob's and Tiberius' responses. </div><div><br></div><div>In the Commons Transition website and books now we have already sets of alternative putting concrete proposals for transition through policy changes, but also movement and polity building perspectives. These provide a good and solid base to start taking the discussions further, in order to develop existing practical and analytical visions provided. This should happen bottom up. And for this what is crucial is to ceate autonomous and horizontal spaces where grassroots inventors from different networks can work out together, with but independent from generalizing theorists, strategists, and funders. This is crucial to be able to go on inventing and adding value on top the provided visions of transition. So creative development of strategies can be developed through wiki like modifications, or forking that provide totally different alternatives. So either, as Tiberius suggest, integrating people and tools that would function and covering the points you raise Anna, or based on the insights provided building a new vision or practice is possible. </div><div><br></div><div>Again, what is really crucial in my humble opinion, is the fact that there has been intensifying convergences between many networks, ideas, research, practice and analyses, also between policy and action based approaches. This made individual and collective contributions merge to create an emerging picture of integrated networks of networks, in a way has the potential to grow over and dominate the existing mode of production. </div><div><br></div><div>This has been happening exactly in parallel to the intensified good and bad happenings, as in greece, Spain, and Syria/Iraq/Ukraine, Asia-pasific, Africa and cyberia, with the unfolding of the systemic crisis. The challenge is now to make this happen: to practically work on networking variety of alternative modes of associated production, which are addressing similar tools and dynamics, cultures and so on, in a way reaching specific social purposes and targets become possible. Thinking of how to integrate tools and networks of Sensorica, cic, faircoop, mikorizal, gnlu, edu-factory, schools of commons, social strike,.. </div><div><br></div><div>As Tiberius said, not everything will become parts of a universal machine like system, but a live and complex living organism that is part of Gaia, or cosmos we are part of. We won't all use Mikroizal, but might chose to modularly integrate various aspects, like production, learning, coop exchange, p2p insurance, so on of various alternatives to each other... while some of these forms focus on individual and enterprise, when implementing tools to network, others will focus on workers, some coops, elderly, children, land, money... Still not sure if it would work.. </div><div><br></div><div>Yet one thing is sure, form the history, that created Lenin's, Stalin's, and many other elements of what Bogdanov called<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;"> the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">"IntermediaryIntelligentsia"</span></div><div><div class="page" title="Page 40"><div class="layoutArea"><div class="column"><p><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">"As </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">early </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">as </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">1906, </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">in the third volume of his seminal work. </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">Empi</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">riomonizm, </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">Bogdanov </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">had </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">certainly </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">admitted the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">possibility </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">that "in </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 1pt;">cer</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">tain conditions" the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">"ideologues" </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">of </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">society might </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">themselves </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">acquire </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">the
status of an </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">"organizing </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">class" which would rule over the </span><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">masses. </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">How</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">ever, </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">in other works </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">published </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">before 1917 he had asked whether under </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">capitalism </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">intelligentsia might acquire </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">such a status and his answer
</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">had been in the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">negative. </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">At </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">most, </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">he </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">acknowledged </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">that in certain his</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">torical </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">periods </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">when relations between </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">competing </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">social classes were in </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">a state of </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">equilibrium </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">intelligentsia might </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">assert itself as an </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">independent social </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">group,</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">"above cl</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">ass,"</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">and he cited the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">example </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">of the liberal </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">faction aroundLe National in France in the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">1840s, </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">that of the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">"Legal
Populists" </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">in Russia </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">during </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">the </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">1890s, </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">and that of the "Liberationists"of
the 1900s. For </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">Bogdanov, </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">as a </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -1pt;">rule, </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">however: </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">The </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">intermediary intelligentsia groups </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">of </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">society </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">work </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">ideologically </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: 2pt;">not for them</span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">selves but for others and so </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">they </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">can in no </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">way </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">act as a </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">determining </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">force in
</span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700; vertical-align: -2pt;">pursuing </span><span style="font-size: 8pt; font-family: Times; font-weight: 700;">the cultural tasks of our time."</span></p><p>Based on the above insight, taken form Bogdanov, I think it is really crucial that the working people, peer producers, commoners, who has the practical and intellectual ability to unify their mental and manual work, strategic and practical creative and innovative skills to determine how to design and realize the transition will take place. That is why I believe it is crucial not only for intellectuals, even for the sake of ruling classes' survival, we emphasis verbally and action wise the importance of networks and classes being the creators and vanguards of their own present and future politics. That is why we need to give special care and attention to create enabling spaces, channels, and tools for further empowerment of these alternatives and every potential individual who is needed to join and and give a hand in such empowerment by empowering themselves. </p><p>Again as Tiberius calls, involvement of people like you, me, and all others in developing, designing, and implementing tools like Sensorica, faircoop, Mikroizal, GNLU, global square... is the thing. Any support from intermeridate intelligentsia, enabling ngos, civil society, partner state or other institutional perspectives are and can be really helpful to realize the transition, but as a secondary contribution. If we see the latter more important it means we already started to create possible future ruling classes.</p><p>Orsan </p></div></div></div></div><div><br></div><div><br>On 15 Feb 2015, at 15:41, Anna Harris <<a href="mailto:anna@shsh.co.uk">anna@shsh.co.uk</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><div>It is interesting to see the link between Sensorica as presented by Tiberius, and the article sent in by Francine Maestrum. As I understand it, Sensorica <span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">allows people to claim all the value they contribute, including adjustments for reputation, through a </span>value equation, endorsed by all participants. Very appealing for those who have something to contribute, and offers an alternative to the capitalist economy which thrives on extracting surplus value.</div><div><br></div><div>Francine is wanting to provide for those who for whatever reason can't contribute as part of that innovative model of production. And perhaps we should ask - shouldn't that be part of the model? What happens in Sensorica when there is sickness or accidents? Child care? Elderly relatives? Need a holiday? Those with disabilities? Perhaps this was mentioned and I missed it. 'Fairness' is not as simple as an algorithm which rewards on the basis of contribution. Some may benefit If they remain fit and well. But it seems pretty precarious if there is no support to fall back on when they are not. </div><div><br></div><div>Calling something a commons doesn't just mean that something is available to all, it also means making sure that people have the ability to take advantage of that availability. In this new society we have to find a way to care for each other to ensure that we don't just reproduce a system which enables some to prosper, while others suffer.</div><div><br></div><div>Anna</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>On 13 Feb 2015, at 21:45, Orsan <<a href="mailto:orsan1234@gmail.com">orsan1234@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><div><br></div><div><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><div>Thanks Bob! </div><div><br></div>We were discussing manual-mental labour division, thinkers and doers, economy and politics. I just want to recommend everyone to take time and look in to Mikorizal and watch the below video, from Tiberius of Sensorica.<div><br><a href="http://mikorizal.org/groups.html">http://mikorizal.org/groups.html</a><div><br></div><div><a href="http://youtu.be/Ixgp8_B9g5A">http://youtu.be/Ixgp8_B9g5A</a></div><div><br></div><div>Direction of possible fusion between open value networking, open coops, like fair.coop, multi stakeholder cooperatives and the unionism I have been promoting bears the potential of overcoming those divisions. we better get ready for the scaling up of unifying political-economies in form of polity as well. If Syriza can find a way to facilitate such transformation it has a chance. Podemos in Spain is closer, though both have some disadvantages. In case they can envisage and open a path to, some thing can be called, Internet of Emancipatory Everything we might have a chance to stand together before both big capitalist class or rising dark Internet of Everything as the latest stage of capitalism. </div></div><div><br></div><div>Orsan</div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>NetworkedLabour mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:NetworkedLabour@lists.contrast.org">NetworkedLabour@lists.contrast.org</a></span><br><span><a href="http://lists.contrast.org/mailman/listinfo/networkedlabour">http://lists.contrast.org/mailman/listinfo/networkedlabour</a></span><br></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></body></html>