<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:bookman old style, new york, times, serif;font-size:16px"><div class="" style=""><span class="" style="">Thank you, Michel and Vasilis for getting the actual clarification data. I had meant the actual "ministers" though it is good to know that women are there to help out as "deputy ministers". That is more sincerely meant, than it might sound.</span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span class="" style="">But no Michel, I like you too much and value the work you do with the P2P Foundation too much,
to let you or the P2P Foundation off the hook as accepting that asking for more female (and other previously left out "others") representation in the leadership of a modern industrialised "new-vision" Commons-oriented government in the year 2015, is too "radical" an ask. Again, that makes no "Commons sense" to me and shouldn't to anyone.</span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span class="" style="">I think my "support" (and Anna's clearly it seemed to me) is actually given rather than withdrawn in these very comments, warning that not addressing these underlying "misses",
certainly in not admitting and validating them, is the very reality-most-likely to-derail any hoped for true value-systems change that all sustainable political-economic systems rest on or certainly fall on, ultimately. </span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span class="" style="">Why it is seen as "either/or" and oppositional to even raise these warning flags in order to easily, and it is quite easily done, rectify them or put it on the agenda to rectify them down the line, seems to me a very old paradigm to work from. I certainly understand not letting the "perfect be
the enemy of the good" when there are so many real "enemies", but as my last comment on this, this would seem to fall more under </span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span class="" style="">"</span><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; " class="">but we are practicing what we preach in the p2p foundation, with difficulty, with problems, but attempting it nevertheless" -- Michel</span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial,
'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; " class=""><br class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; background-color: transparent; "><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; " class=""><span style="font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; " class="">In essence, it is this discussion that makes me feel that's true, not in <span style="font-style: italic;">not</span> having it at all.</span><br class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; background-color:
transparent; font-style: normal; "><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; " class=""><span style="font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; " class=""><br></span></span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; " class=""><span style="font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; " class="">Really supportively meant, Michel,</span></span></div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; "
class=""><span style="font-family: 'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif; " class="">June</span></span></div><div class="" style=""><br class="" style=""></div> <div style="font-family: bookman old style, new york, times, serif; font-size: 16px;" class=""> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" class=""> <div dir="ltr" class="" style=""> <hr size="1" class="" style=""> <font size="2" face="Arial" class="" style=""> <b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight:bold;" class="">From:</span></b> P2P Foundation mailing list <p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org><br class="" style=""> <b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">To:</span></b> Anna Harris <anna@shsh.co.uk> <br class="" style=""><b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">Cc:</span></b> "p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org"
<p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org>; "networkedlabour@lists.contrast.org" <networkedlabour@lists.contrast.org> <br class="" style=""> <b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">Sent:</span></b> Thursday, February 5, 2015 9:24 AM<br class="" style=""> <b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight: bold;" class="">Subject:</span></b> Re: [P2P-F] [NetworkedLabour] [Networkedlabour] Another Politics - After Syriza<br class="" style=""> </font> </div> <div class="" style=""><br class="" style=""><div id="yiv7929524729" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style="">by the way, I am not disagreeing that such a radical shift is desirable, what I am pointing out is the complexity of this wished for change, and especially the belief that this radical change can happen in an instant in time, rather than a process;<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">the
only realistic option is that the people who think they are ready, start right now with micro-communities ... as someone who has lived in three failed communes, I can tell you, not even that is easy ...</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">but we are practicing what we preach in the p2p foundation, with difficulty, with problems, but attempting it nevertheless</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">but I don't find it productive to blame social movements because they are not perfect and in that way, if support is withdrawn rather than constructively embraced, to in fact support the social forces that are tremendously worth ./</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">we have already seen how the anti-political and purist attitude of some 15M and Occupiers led to radically worse right wing
governments destroying the social fabric even more,</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">so I am with the people who are imperfectly trying to better the situations,</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">radical vision, meliorist approaches .. until we can move faster and further, as reality will dictate</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Michel</div></div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><div class="" style="">On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:22 PM, Anna Harris <span dir="ltr" class="" style=""><<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:anna@shsh.co.uk" target="_blank" href="mailto:anna@shsh.co.uk" class="" style="">anna@shsh.co.uk</a>></span> wrote:<br clear="none" class="" style=""><blockquote class="" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex;"><div class="" id="yiv7929524729yqt19344" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style="">Hello June, </div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Thanks for your contribution. The attachment you gave is only the abstract of the article you mention. Can you give a link to the full article?</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Thanks,</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Anna<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">On 29 Jan 2015, at 21:31, P2P Foundation mailing list <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" class=""
style="">p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org</a>> wrote:<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style=""><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:bookman old style, new york, times, serif;font-size:16px;" class=""><div class="" style=""><span class="" style="">Well, I am late to this conversation below but am energized by the fact that someone else led the charge on these always "never-time-to-fully-excavate" but in the end, <span style="font-style:italic;" class="">trumping</span> issues of how human beings and ultimately all human organizations succeed or do not succeed. Either these issues are explicitly addressed in any "new" government model from its inception and thus run differently from its inception, or history has taught us they will face breakdown on the same old deeply taught emotional/social oppression that Anna so effectively quotes below. Hooray Anna, that
you raise your voice on this so eloquently again. I know the silence that we still face, and I support you for trying, regardless.</span></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;font-style:normal;" class=""><span class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></span></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;" class=""><span class="" style="">Here's the thing and I will frame this far less eloquently than you did, Anna: patriarchy is at root a "bully culture". If any true transformational change is to be imagined, it has to be imagined in an <span style="font-style:italic;" class="">explicitly</span> non-bully "frame" (non-patriarchal, non-soley-left brain rational quantitative discounting of qualitative and felt experience and intelligences), <span
style="font-style:italic;" class="">from its inception</span>. Otherwise, as has been the historic reality, once the rational and thoughtful men finally do get into power you still get "power struggles", (as happened in the French Revolution, the Russian Revolution, all
"revolutions" that didn't "revolve out" these underlying power premises). This, despite the often truly "enlightened" and liberating well argued <span style="font-style:italic;" class="">rational</span> dominant understanding that <span style="font-style:italic;" class="">still doesn't address these deeper emotional social constructs</span> in any explicit way from the beginning of that "new" power assumption. Thus, ultimately the "bullies" always end up winning those power struggles as the old patriarchal paradigm reasserts itself, having never truly been transformed at the level that it most matters and actually changes human relationships.</span></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;font-style:italic;" class=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times,
serif;background-color:transparent;" class="">I truly understand and even empathize Michel, with your frustration, so similar to my rational computer engineering but truly radical thinking husband on these same "global challenges" -- how big they are, how critical some things are that must be addressed to retain any possibility of sustainability together, against the powers amassed against any potential transformation at all. But you will ultimately find, as Anna and I have pointed out numerous times before with specific examples even within this organization as with any organization trying for these deep and true lasting transformations, that the breakdowns will happen in communication and mostly mis-communication, in emotional game-playing, in ego battles that no one was willing to prepare for addressing. Anna and I know they will. We have watched it all our lives from the outside seats. As have others of either gender, but still on
"the outside".</div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;" class=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;font-style:normal;" class="">Dante understood this premise as the base of the underlying emotional/social and cultural construct that currently dominates, which includes patriarchy at its intrinsic base. A base assumption that generates all of its subsequent superiority/inferiority divisions which ultimately always come into play including racism, classicism, elite-educationism, imperialism, homophobia and numerous others of these most powerful de-railers of cross-cultural communications within any true "commons" vision of the "people".</div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style',
'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;font-style:normal;" class=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;" class=""><span style="font-style:normal;" class="">You, Syriza, Podemos...all can be understandably overwhelmed with the immediate political-economic priorities. But there are many who deeply understand that </span><span style="font-style:italic;" class="">these socially destructive realities too are a deep priority and the deeper essence of any true geo-poitical transformation</span> and willing to spend their time -- if validated and empowered to -- addressing it and reminding you of it, as an essential priority too, now not later. Or, what we also <span style="font-style:italic;" class="">know </span>deeply is that without this focus too, any real change will implode on these
lines more completely or...not truly be a "change"of any real transformation in the end, at all.</div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;font-style:italic;" class=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;" class="">For those interested in the deeper context of that kind of true transformation where it makes the most difference in our resulting human relationships and organizations, my attached article here for the Journal of Sustainable Education's next issue (out on Valentine's Day) addresses these concepts explicitly in, "<span style="font-style:italic;" class="">What has Love Got to do With Transformative Education</span>?"</div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times,
serif;background-color:transparent;font-style:italic;" class=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;" class="">I don't mind it being disregarded or considered "down in the noise" of the immediate, pressing "realities". We all have our areas of expertise and deepest effectiveness. The key is to know when they are blinding you to other potential huge pitfalls avoidable by listening to and including those "other" voices that warn you of the areas you are not validating or understanding, as potentially most destructive to your hopes and dreams in ways you haven't the ability or natural interest to see and thus prepare for preventing. Because you'll never get the "time" later, in time to avoid the conflict-constructs already embedded and allowed to continue at these levels.</div><div
style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;" class=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;" class=""><span style="font-style:normal;" class="">Sincerely meant, as I know how deeply you do work on the parts that you do believe are most critical. Nonetheless, this too can still be done...by others who know why it also is potentially, </span><span style="font-style:italic;" class="">just</span> as critical to include, if true "change" actually is allowed and empowered to happen.</div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;font-style:normal;" class=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div
style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;font-style:normal;" class="">Best hopes,</div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;background-color:transparent;font-style:normal;" class="">June</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div> <div style="font-family:'bookman old style', 'new york', times, serif;font-size:16px;" class=""> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif;font-size:16px;" class=""> <div dir="ltr" class="" style=""> <hr size="1" class="" style=""> <font face="Arial" class="" style=""> <b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight:bold;" class="">From:</span></b> P2P Foundation mailing list <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" target="_blank"
href="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" class="" style="">p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org</a>><br clear="none" class="" style=""> <b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight:bold;" class="">To:</span></b> P2P Foundation mailing list <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" class="" style="">p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org</a>> <br clear="none" class="" style=""><b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight:bold;" class="">Cc:</span></b> "<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:networkedlabour@lists.contrast.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:networkedlabour@lists.contrast.org" class="" style="">networkedlabour@lists.contrast.org</a>" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:networkedlabour@lists.contrast.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:networkedlabour@lists.contrast.org" class=""
style="">networkedlabour@lists.contrast.org</a>> <br clear="none" class="" style=""> <b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight:bold;" class="">Sent:</span></b> Thursday, January 29, 2015 6:39 PM<br clear="none" class="" style=""> <b class="" style=""><span style="font-weight:bold;" class="">Subject:</span></b> Re: [P2P-F] [Networkedlabour] Another Politics - After Syriza<br clear="none" class="" style=""> </font> </div><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""> <div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style="">After my enthusiastic foray into Otto Scharma's U.Lab I have to report that I found it another liberal attempt to encourage people to become 'change makers', <span class="" style="">supporting them in a self blaming exercise, where fear and greed are seen as the problems of our social dis/ease, without linking this to social and economic
pressures. </span></div><div class="" style=""><span class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style=""><span class="" style="">Some good ideas of deep listening, connecting head, heart and will, moving from ego to Eco, focussing on what is emerging, but falling short of a radical critique which could reveal the enormity of the task in hand. </span></div><div class="" style=""><span class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style=""><span class="" style="">Going beyond the shift in consciousness required to let go of old habits of thinking, takes us to an unexplored place on the edge of what we know. Few are willing to go
there, because everywhere we judge, and we are judged, by what we know. In this culture ruled by science, there does not seem to be any room or any relevance for not knowing. Yet I persist in trying to bring it to the attention of those on this email list.</span></div><div class="" style=""><span class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style=""><span class="" style="">Anna</span></div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">On 28 Jan 2015, at 10:57, Anna Harris <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:anna@shsh.co.uk" target="_blank" href="mailto:anna@shsh.co.uk" class="" style="">anna@shsh.co.uk</a>> wrote:<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class=""
style=""></div><div class="" style=""></div></div></div><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style="">
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<div class="" style=""><div style="margin:0px 0px 0px 3px;padding:0px;overflow:hidden;" class=""><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;" class="">A very different answer to the same question from Otto Scharma :</div><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;" class=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;" class=""><font color="#000000" class="" style=""><span class="" style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" style="margin-right:3px;padding:1px;" class="" href="">[–]</a><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.reddit.com/user/rodneyrod" style="text-decoration:none;margin-right:0.5em;font-weight:bold;" class="">rodneyrod</a><span class="" style=""></span> <span class="" style="">6 points</span> 6 days ago
</span></font></div><br clear="none" class="" style=""><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;" class=""><div style="margin:5px 0px;padding:0px;max-width:60em;" class=""><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;" class=""><span class="" style="">Otto, as you have worked with change makers across the globe where have you seen the most resistance/discomfort in people as they attempt to enter the "presencing" stage of listening? How can those observations assist us as we open this journey to others? </span></div></div></div><ul style="margin:0px;padding:0px;list-style:none;" class=""><li style="margin:0px;padding:0px 4px 0px 0px;display:inline-block;border:none;" class=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2t6gy3/iama_a_senior_lecturer_at_the_mit_sloan_school_of/cnw57t3" style="text-decoration:none;font-weight:bold;padding:0px 1px;" class="">perma-link</a></li></ul></div><div style="margin:10px 0px
0px 15px;padding:0px;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:dotted;border-left-color:rgb(221,221,255);" class=""><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;list-style-type:none;" class=""><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px 0px 0px 15px;" class=""><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;" class=""><font color="#000000" class="" style=""><span class="" style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" name="14b4b9da914a9440_cnw5gks" class="" style="" href=""></a></span></font></div><div style="margin:0px 7px 0px 0px;padding:0px;float:left;overflow:hidden;width:15px;" class=""><div style="margin:2px auto 0px;padding:0px;min-height:14px;width:15px;outline:none;background-image:url(http://www.redditstatic.com/sprite-reddit.JqPSSyjOUZE.png);background-repeat:no-repeat no-repeat;" class=""></div><div style="margin:2px auto
0px;padding:0px;min-height:14px;width:15px;outline:none;background-image:url(http://www.redditstatic.com/sprite-reddit.JqPSSyjOUZE.png);background-repeat:no-repeat no-repeat;" class=""></div></div><div style="margin:0px 0px 0px 3px;padding:0px;overflow:hidden;" class=""><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;" class=""><font color="#000000" class="" style=""><span class="" style=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" style="margin-right:3px;padding:1px;" class="" href="">[–]</a><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.reddit.com/user/OttoScharmer" style="text-decoration:none;margin-right:0.5em;padding:1px 8px 1px 22px!important;" class="">OttoScharmer</a><span class="" style="">[<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" title="submitter" target="_blank" href="http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2t6gy3/iama_a_senior_lecturer_at_the_mit_sloan_school_of/" style="text-decoration:none;" class="">S</a>]</span> <span class="" style="">5
points</span> 6 days ago </span></font></div><br clear="none" class="" style=""><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;" class=""><div style="margin:5px 0px;padding:0px;max-width:60em;" class=""><div style="margin:0px;padding:0px;" class=""><span class="" style="">i have found that most people who, regardless of their sector, are exposed to real world change, and have to hold the space for people related changes (or are exposed to the creative process one way or another) are already well prepared to drop to these deeper levels of operating. so where is it not the case? with people who are stuck in powerpoints worlds of headquarters and politics--sometimes also people that are just very remote of real reality, like old style academia... but overall i am VERY surprised how significant the readiness for these deeper levels are --although that readiness is usually not conscious (yet)</span></div></div></div><span class="" style=""></span><ul
class="" style=""><li style="margin:0px;padding:0px 4px 0px 0px;display:inline-block;border:none;" class=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2t6gy3/iama_a_senior_lecturer_at_the_mit_sloan_school_of/cnw5gks" style="text-decoration:none;font-weight:bold;padding:0px 1px;" class="">perma-link</a></li><li style="margin:0px;padding:0px 4px;display:inline-block;border:none;" class=""><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2t6gy3/iama_a_senior_lecturer_at_the_mit_sloan_school_of/#cnw57t3" style="text-decoration:none;font-weight:bold;padding:0px 1px;" class="">parent</a></li></ul></div></div></div></div></div>
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</div></div><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style=""><div style="font-family:arial;font-size:small;" class=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
<br clear="none" class="" style=""><div class="" style="">On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 5:01 PM, P2P Foundation mailing list <span dir="ltr" class="" style=""><<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" class="" style="">p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org</a>></span> wrote:<br clear="none" class="" style=""><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;" class=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style="">hi Anna,<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">At the p2p foundation we stress personal and interpersonal change and facilitation, but at the same time, we have to be realistic in this, what is already possible but very difficult in small groups of committed people may not be possible for society at large ... For understanding this, and though I'm critical of the
authoritarian interpretations of that tradition, the integral psychology of clare graves remains fundamental
..</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Detailed studies by Susan Cook-Greuters have determined that at most 2% of the population have integrative consciousness, with 30% more or less having this as a aspirational consciousness ..</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">I take great comfort in the growth of participative culture and skills now evident in the new mutualized working spaces but this is far from being the general culture ..</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Again, referring to the scheme of John Heron, I would say that for the greater masses, we are at the potential change of stage 2 to 3, with significant minorities at four ..</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">so here is how I see it:</div><div class=""
style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">* develop fully participative cultures for mature peer producing communities</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">* develop deeper participative potentialities for the aspirational parts of the population
(active citizenship)</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">* embed participative process in the general social technology of our time, to upgrade the general culture ..</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">A lot then further depends on the relative positioning of scarcity vs abundance dynamics ...</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">for abundance context, the generalization of peer governance is very realistic</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">for scarcity contexts, the choice between hierarchical, democratic-representative, and market-driven allocation mechanisms remains entirely open</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">see for example how the wikipedia re-introduced a rather
toxic bureaucracy by re-introducing artificial scarcity ... (notability requirements to be decide by elite editors)</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">just today, I am involved in a frustrating dialogue with a feminist activist who did not even want to share even
excerpts of her book on 'moneyless living' .. in other words, she is creating a artificial scarcity of her own book, that is technically freely copyable, in order to 'swap' it in exchange for something else ... reproducing the artificial scarcities in so-called advanced milieus ... moneyless living for those that have the money to buy it ..</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">I'm sure you can find similar contradictions in all of us, including me ..</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">in conclusion, we are not ready to shed relative domination processes for any pure egalitarianism any time soon,</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Michel</div></div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style="">On Mon,
Jan 26, 2015 at 1:05 PM, Anna Harris <span dir="ltr" class="" style=""><<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:anna@shsh.co.uk" target="_blank" href="mailto:anna@shsh.co.uk" class="" style="">anna@shsh.co.uk</a>></span> wrote:<br clear="none" class="" style=""></div></div><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;" class=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><span class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><span class="" style=""></span></div><div class="" style=""><div class="" style="">Amid all the euphoria in celebrating the Greek landslide, and following Michel's integrative approach, the points in the article below need to be emphasised. We all carry within us the wounds of oppression however much we feel we have cast them aside, and they will surface again in the new post capitalist structures unless we
put some focus individually and collectively on healing ourselves and becoming whole. </div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">'the wounding through oppression that we all experience shows up in our organizing, and have permeated organizational culture except where the influence of feminists and others committed to
transformational work has created a different way of creating structure, that prioritizes a strategy and collective struggle rooted in healing and wholeness.'</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Pauli Friere spoke about this in his Pedagogy of the Oppressed.</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">What does that mean? How do we do that? Often it seems there isn't time to go into this now, let's get into power first, then we can see to these issues. That's when the multitude becomes an instrument, and arguments between hierarchy and horizontality appear to be abstract concepts with no people involved.</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">How do we become more fully human in our relationships with each other? What makes it particularly difficult is that there is no ready made formula - follow
these steps and you will get there. No. This is a step into the unknown. But that also makes it an exciting exploration. </div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style="">Anna</div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">On 25 Jan 2015, at 11:38, P2P Foundation mailing list <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org" class="" style="">p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org</a>> wrote:<br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div><div class="" style=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div style="word-wrap:break-word;" class=""><div class="" style=""><a rel="nofollow"
shape="rect" target="_blank" href="https://www.opendemocracy.net/transformation/andrew-willis-garc%C3%A" class="" style="">https://www.opendemocracy.net/transformation/andrew-willis-garc%C3%A</a>9s/another-politics%E2%80%94from-anticolonial-to-occupy<blockquote type="cite" class="" style=""><div class="" style="">
<div class="" style=""><font color="#0000FF" size="+1" class="" style=""><b class="" style="">Another Politics-from
anti-colonial to Occupy</b></font></div>
<div class="" style=""><i class="" style=""><b class="" style="">Chris Dixon's new book identifies four principles that
underpin the success of transformative social movements.</b></i></div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">Andrew Willis Garcés 7 January 2015</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">[This article originally appeared in<i class="" style=""> Waging
Nonviolence</i>.]</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">
Seven years ago I worked at a tenant and worker organizing group in
Washington, D.C. We referred to ourselves as a "movement-building"
organization, but weren't always clear what we meant by that. One
evening I was out door-knocking with one of our members, James, an
African American man in his 50s. He asked me about a conference some
of us had attended in Atlanta the previous week, the U.S. Social
Forum.<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
"What was the big theme there that stuck out to you?" he
asked.<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
It was a good question. At that moment, the DJ Unk song "Walk It
Out" was booming from a nearby car.<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
"Well, I was most impressed by the groups that really try to walk
out their beliefs-connecting all the dots between racism,
capitalism, even imperialism, and the inner work we have to do as
people to overcome the things we've learned."<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
I explained more about what that meant to me.<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
He shook his head, amused.<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
"That's a tall order!" He thought about it a little more.
"When will we get time for all that?"<br clear="none" class="" style="">
</div>
<div class="" style="">That tall order is the subject of Chris Dixon's book<i class="" style=""> Another
Politics,</i> newly released by University of California Press. The
product of dozens of interviews conducted with community organizers
over the last decade, the book is an excellent distillation of what
Dixon calls "another politics," a shared political orientation
that unites grassroots organizers working from similar principles in
the United States and Canada across issue, movement, sector, strategy
and identity.</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">
Through the interviews, he identifies four core principles that unite
left "anti-authoritarian" organizers across different "strands"
of struggle, transcending traditional notions of issue-based
organization:</div>
<blockquote class="" style="">. being against domination of all kinds;</blockquote>
<blockquote class="" style="">. prioritizing the development of new social relations and
forms of social organization in the process of struggle;</blockquote>
<blockquote class="" style="">. linking struggles for improvements in people's lives
to long-term transformative visions; and</blockquote>
<blockquote class="" style="">. grassroots organizing from the bottom-up.</blockquote>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">In regards to these different strands, he writes, "We braid
them together as we work collectively and build relationships across
politics, campaigns and movements: anarchist labor organizers draw on
analytical frameworks from women of color feminism; radical queer
activists use community-based models for dealing with violence,
developed by anti-racist feminists and prison abolitionists."</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">He explores how Occupy Wall Street, anti-colonial movements, and
INCITE! Women of Color Against Violence, among other groups, have
contributed to developing "another politics" across decades.</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">Dixon digs even deeper, characterizing organizations practicing
"another politics" as being explicit about their "collective
refusal" of oppression-specifically, as incorporating "the four
anti's" of : anti-authoritarianism; anti-capitalism;
anti-oppression; and anti-imperialism, into their work. This left me
wondering how some organizations might "fit" this taxonomy-what
if your group has a handle on economic exploitation, for instance, but
relies on charismatic leadership?</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">
But Dixon is nevertheless clear about organizations that he sees as
practicing "another politics," and the book is most compelling
when he recounts movement-building victories, like the story of
Canada's multi-city immigrant rights group<b class="" style=""> No One is
Illegal</b>:</div>
<blockquote class="" style="">
<blockquote class="" style="">"In a stunning December 2007 action, some 2,000 people,
largely South Asian, blockaded the Vancouver International Airport to
stop Singh's impending deportation. And starting with an
'Education Not Deportation' campaign in 2006, NOII-Toronto launched
a multi-year fight for Toronto to become a solidarity city, where all
people can access city services regardless of immigration status.
Organizing across sectors and services, they finally won in
2013."</blockquote>
<blockquote class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></blockquote>
</blockquote>
<div class="" style="">Dixon also uses the book to highlight "ideas rarely in
writing," exploring dynamics of movement-building organization that
don't get much print. For instance, he writes about the process of
integrating not just issue lenses but our whole selves-creating
community and organization that operates at the speed of the
whole.</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">As Dixon writes, "recognizing and deliberately fostering
feelings and relationships as essential ingredients for transformative
struggle" is still not a widespread practice, and he points out that
this is not a new phenomenon, as the Black Panthers and Student
Nonviolent Coordinating Committee also sought "to develop common
expectations about how people should treat one another."</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">Continuing this thread, he also counts as emergent practices
among "another politics" practitioners, forms of organizing that
affirm families and domestic and reproductive work simultaneously with
challenging systemic inequity, and moving beyond an individual-focused
anti-oppression politics.</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">Dixon and the people he interviews point out that the wounding
through oppression that we all experience shows up in our organizing,
and have permeated organizational culture except where the influence
of feminists and others committed to transformational work has created
a different way of creating structure, that prioritizes a strategy and
collective struggle rooted in healing and wholeness. This increasing
focus on wholeness and wellness, seen in the recent popularity of
integrating somatics and other healing disciplines into community
organizing, can only make us more adept at building a broader and more
resilient web of movements.<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
And Dixon helps unpack the challenges unique to movement-building
organizations, which, he says, must move towards specific victories
and goals, while also moving through a process that creates new ways
of being, doing and relating, that avoid replicating oppressive
practices. All while avoiding "ruts" common to anti-authoritarian
groups, like knee-jerk non-hierarchy, and the "burn bright, burn
out" cycle of organizations that rise and fall quickly.</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">Dixon illustrates this point with a fantastic metaphor offered by
Project South's Steph Guillioud, comparing different forms of
organization to different kinds of cars suited to particular
functions:</div>
<blockquote class="" style="">
<blockquote class="" style="">"The variations in vehicles don't change the map, they
don't change the road, they don't change the need for people to
drive and people in the back or the people moving it. We will always
have and need the people who can push it and the people that can work
on the insides, the people who can never get a ride, et
cetera."</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style="">It's rare to find a book on social movements written explicitly
for people with less academic credentials than its author. Dixon, who
wrote the book for a PhD program, takes care to explain terms as they
come up; he doesn't assume we know about ethnography ("analyzing
lived culture while experiencing it"). And he gives his interviewees
plenty of airtime to put their own spin on, for instance, "affective
organizing," which becomes "not being a fucking asshole," in the
wonderfully succinct words of Bay Area activist Harjit Singh Gill.<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
Still, the number of concepts he introduces feels overwhelming at
times, and I longed for a glossary or flow chart when concepts like
"non-instrumental organizing" popped up (which, it's worth noting,
refers to the analysis and strategies people can create when they come
together in dialogue and struggle as peers, as opposed to treating
people as instruments to be manipulated, or pieces on a figurative
chess board to mobilize toward a predetermined end).<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
"Anti-authoritarian," then, could be shorthand for "principled
organizing"-organizing that gets down to the roots, that refuses
to settle for electing a slightly better candidate, for selling out
our potential allies to scoop up a superficial win, or that sees the
path to victory as anything less than the destination itself.<br clear="none" class="" style="">
<br clear="none" class="" style="">
Towards the end of the book, I was reminded of my exchange that day
with James. Clearly, as Dixon demonstrates, there are mixed-class
organizations that make time for individual and collective healing
practices, for skillshares and strategy seminars, for discussion
groups, for intentionally developing and evaluating leadership, and
for developing organizational structure. But increasingly, as people
are forced to work longer hours for lower incomes, I have to wonder:
How are organizations adapting to support their people to do more with
less?</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">
I longed for more detail on what day-to-day life is like for an
organizer in the six specifically-chosen cities from which Dixon chose
his interview subjects. What does it look like to practice "another
politics" in Atlanta, for instance? It's worth asking, given that
the book is structured around questions like, "How can we most
productively manifest our visions through our organizing work?" Like
a good organizing mentor, Dixon (and his interviewees) gives us
insight without "right" answers, helping to deepen our
understanding of commonalities and remind us of the deep roots of the
"another politics" leftist lineage.</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style=""> (((((( )))))</div>
<div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>
<div class="" style=""><i class="" style=""><b class="" style="">Andrew Willis Garcés</b></i> works with Training for
Change and has led trainings for immigrant activists in several US
states on campaign strategy and civil disobedience. Read more of his
work at <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.porvida.org/" class="" style="">www.porvida.org/</a>.<br clear="none" class="" style="">
</div>
</div>
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<br clear="none" class="" style=""></blockquote></div><br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="all" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>-- <br clear="none" class="" style=""><div class="" style=""><div dir="ltr" class="" style=""><div class="" style="">Check out the Commons Transition Plan here at: <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://en.wiki.floksociety.org/w/Research_Plan" class="" style="">http://en.wiki.floksociety.org/w/Research_Plan</a> </div><div class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""></div>P2P Foundation: <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://p2pfoundation.net/" class="" style="">http://p2pfoundation.net</a> - <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/" class="" style="">http://blog.p2pfoundation.net</a> <br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style=""><a
rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation" class="" style=""></a>Updates: <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://twitter.com/mbauwens" class="" style="">http://twitter.com/mbauwens</a>; <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens" class="" style="">http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens</a><br clear="none" class="" style=""><br clear="none" class="" style="">#82 on the (En)Rich list: <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/" class="" style="">http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/</a> <br clear="none" class="" style=""></div></div>
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