hi george,<br><br>don't you agree that a lot of open source projects have some degree of autocratic rule (the so-called benevolent dictator phenomenum), in order to insure productivity .. .(though this does not involve command and control over labour, nor over the allocation of resources, but rather over the post-hoc quality control mechanisms)<br>
<br>now, regarding " self-rule leads to totalitarianism"<br><br>this was the debate between rosa luxemburg and lenin, discussed in the poulantzas books which I have been reading this year (p. agrees with rl). Basically, Rosa Luxemburg warned that a total reliance on self-rule through soviets, could lead to authoritarianism, so she urged the bolcheviks to retain representational parliaments in a structure of dual power ... I tend to agree that we need plurarchic forms of governance keeping each other in check, to avoid the degeneracy of any form of self-rule that may be the 'only game in town' ..<br>
<br>I'm also warming up more and more to greek sortition mechanisms .. interestingly, this is now also being discussed by the new Anonymous Party I believe ..<br><br>Michel<br>
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jul 14, 2011 at 12:22 AM, George Dafermos <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:G.N.Dafermos@tudelft.nl">G.N.Dafermos@tudelft.nl</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
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<div style="direction: ltr; font-family: Tahoma; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 10pt;">Yes, you're right: the interviewee (MT) uses the word - erroneously - in both senses, without realising he's contradicting himself by saying first that social conduct in his world
is based on players' self-rule and then going on to say that his authority is fast becoming 'autocratic' (i.e. totalitarian).
<br>
<br>
the point he's apparently making is that self-rule is the norm for vast sections of eve space that remain free from 'policing' but authority inside the big corporations/alliances of eve tends to be autocratic (i.e. centralised in the hands of one person). yet,
there is no logical connection between the two: there's no proof - neither in the real world nor in eve - that self-rule leads to totalitarianism.
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<br>
g.<br>
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<div style="direction: ltr;"><font color="#000000" face="Tahoma" size="2"><b>From:</b> <a href="mailto:p2p-foundation-bounces@lists.ourproject.org" target="_blank">p2p-foundation-bounces@lists.ourproject.org</a> [<a href="mailto:p2p-foundation-bounces@lists.ourproject.org" target="_blank">p2p-foundation-bounces@lists.ourproject.org</a>] on behalf of Apostolis Xekoukoulotakis [<a href="mailto:xekoukou@gmail.com" target="_blank">xekoukou@gmail.com</a>]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 13, 2011 6:09 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> P2P Foundation mailing list<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [P2P-F] autocracy as most efficient governance?<br>
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<div>I think that what he is saying is that he is the ultimate ruler, ie an autocracy.�</div>
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<div class="gmail_quote">2011/7/13 George Dafermos <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:G.N.Dafermos@tudelft.nl" target="_blank">G.N.Dafermos@tudelft.nl</a>></span><br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
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Hi Michel,<br>
<br>
there's a basic misunderstanding here. the passage conflates *autocracy* with *autarchy* (i understand that greek words can be confusing..). the author uses the former term to refer to a situation 'where players rule themselves'. That is, what he means to say
is 'self-rule', self-government. that being the case, (s)he should have used the word autarchy instead; or even better: self-rule or self-management. in light of this correction, the subject line of your email should read: 'self-government as the most efficient
governance?'<br>
<br>
x,<br>
g. � <br>
<br>
<br>
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<div style="direction: ltr;"><font color="#000000" face="Tahoma" size="2"><b>From:</b>
<a href="mailto:p2p-foundation-bounces@lists.ourproject.org" target="_blank">p2p-foundation-bounces@lists.ourproject.org</a> [<a href="mailto:p2p-foundation-bounces@lists.ourproject.org" target="_blank">p2p-foundation-bounces@lists.ourproject.org</a>] on behalf
of Michel Bauwens [<a href="mailto:michelsub2004@gmail.com" target="_blank">michelsub2004@gmail.com</a>]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 13, 2011 10:53 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> p2p-foundation<br>
<b>Cc:</b> John Robb; Robert Steele<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [P2P-F] autocracy as most efficient governance?<br>
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<div>see <a href="http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/04/07/eve-online-audience-with-the-king-of-space/" target="_blank">
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/04/07/eve-online-audience-with-the-king-of-space/</a><br>
<br>
Autocracy is the most effective form of government in null sec [the enormous sections of space within Eve Online with no AI police, where players rule themselves]. Council systems don�t work very well. Goonswarm is very lucky in that we have one large corporation,
Goonwaffe, which used to be Goonfleet, which is mostly Something Awful members and has over 2,000 people. Since I�m the CEO of that corporation all the other ancillary corporations in the alliance are relatively powerless, and that works towards an autocracy.
Council-based alliances typically have corporations of roughly the same size.<br>
<br>
(I actually agree with this, in case of warfare, even egalitarian tribes had warchiefs for the duration of hostilities; or does anyone want to challenge thi?)<br clear="all">
<br>
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-- <br>
<span style="font-family: arial,sans-serif; font-size: 13px; border-collapse: collapse;">
<pre style="white-space: pre-wrap;"><br></pre>
<pre style="white-space: pre-wrap;">Sincerely yours, </pre>
<pre style="white-space: pre-wrap;"> Apostolis Xekoukoulotakis</pre>
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