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    <font size="-1"><font face="Verdana">Hallo all,<br>
        <br>
        many thanks to Dante-Gabyrell for raising a some pertinent
        points!<br>
        <br>
        I should add that I moved from England to Germany when I was 22
        and am now 56. My German is thus, in many respects and certainly
        regarding financial ideas and terminology, better than my
        English. The translation (from the German original) was done by
        my eldest daughter (who now lives in the UK but was not raised
        there) and myself. So you'll probably find it a bit wooden and
        lacking in many places.<br>
        <br>
        For the rest, please see below.<br>
        <br>
      </font></font>
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          herzlichen Gr��en,</b><br>
        <br>
        <b style="font-size: 12pt; letter-spacing: 1px;">Tim Reeves</b><br>
        <br>
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        Skype: timothy.reeves (mit Webcam)<br>
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        <a href="http://regionale-wirtschaftsgemeinschaft.info/">regionale-wirtschaftsgemeinschaft.info</a>���
        <a href="http://regional-economic-communities.info/">regional-economic-communities.info</a>���
        <a href="http://rewig-muenchen.de/">rewig-muenchen.de</a><br>
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        � <a href="http://timreeves.de/">timreeves.de</a> � <a
          href="http://www.gemeinwohl.info/">gemeinwohl.info</a> � <a
          href="http://seminarraum-dachau.lasslos.net/">seminarraum-dachau.lasslos.net</a><br>
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    <br>
    Am 18.04.2011 22:37, schrieb Dante-Gabryell Monson:
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:BANLkTinFVdw3aodOLGF88F89Pca+eUoKHA@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Yes, sounds
        like a nice set of initiates to me.</font>
      <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br>
        </font></div>
      <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Yet, Small note
          regarding the barter currency they propose, "co</font><span
          style="font-family: Verdana;">vered/guaranteed by the
          jointly-owned assets."</span>
        <div>
          <font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br>
          </font></div>
        <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">I remember
            discussing such approach in the past.</font></div>
        <div>
          <font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br>
          </font></div>
        <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">In my current
            understanding , such asset ( such as shares ? ) guaranteed
            currency is perhaps an approach taken to create an incentive
            to invest in the local economy ?</font></div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    Yes, it's also, among other reasons, an incentive. But not only to
    invest in local, sustainable businesses, but also to become active
    in the local barter community. Basically we wanted the complementary
    currency to have certain "no nonsense" features:<br>
    <ul>
      <li><b>Comes into circulation</b> a completely different way to
        the fiat money we have now, <br>
        see
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://regional-economic-communities.info/concept/barter-community/currency/">http://regional-economic-communities.info/concept/barter-community/currency/</a><br>
        There is no need or even possibilty for a central bank to govern
        the amount of currency.<br>
        It's the elegant sort of solution that mathematicians like - it
        governs itself automatically.<br>
        More answers about the GROK are here:<br>
        <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://regional-economic-communities.info/faq/barter-community/">http://regional-economic-communities.info/faq/barter-community/</a><br>
      </li>
      <li><b>Asset-backed</b> by deposition of certificates of
        joint-ownership.<br>
        This avoids the problem that many trust- or credit-based barter
        communities have, sadly, experienced. Someone joins, takes
        advantage of some of the offers and then drops out or moves
        away, having effectively "stolen" from the community. In our
        concept, someone must first deposit a certficate paid for with
        dollars (which now can be used for something sensible) to get a
        credit limit on her account. Note: Not credit-money, but credit
        limit! Now, this person can spend GROKs up to her credit limit -
        and if she just disappears off the map, well then the
        certificate now belongs to the Coop and the community has not
        (in balance at least) been harmed. btw someone without any
        certificates to deposit can open an account without a credit
        limit and earn GROKs by selling goods or services.<br>
      </li>
    </ul>
    The Coop now starting up in Munich has decided to allow GROKs also
    to be purchased directly with Euros. This is not a problem for the
    asset backing, since they'll be investing the Euros into local
    businesses, just as with the Euros for the joint-ownership
    certficates. In fact it has a major advantage, because that
    investment can never be given notice on or withdrawn, i.e. the Coop
    can calculate with that money indefinetly. Let me hint that the
    question of joint-ownership certficates is currently under review
    and may be evolved a next step in the near future - any comments
    most welcome!<br>
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:BANLkTinFVdw3aodOLGF88F89Pca+eUoKHA@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div>
        <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br>
          </font></div>
        <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">May be worth
            asking... I cc Tim Reeves.</font></div>
        <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br>
          </font></div>
        <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Yet I feel that
            such approach to currency can be risky as it can lead to the
            monopolization of assets into the hands of a minority, hence
            having the whole regional economy owned by a small minority
            on the medium to long term ?</font></div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    Ah, that would be sad indeed and is definitely not what we want. The
    concept as currently published differentiates ownership certificates
    with and without voting rights (see
    <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://regional-economic-communities.info/concept/cpo/funding/">http://regional-economic-communities.info/concept/cpo/funding/</a>) In
    the General Meeting of the Coop only those holding at least one
    certificate with voting rights are admitted, and every person then
    has one vote. So in fact we have a democratic decision process, in
    which "vote buying" is hardly possible.<br>
    <br>
    In Munich we have gone a step further: Any person can become a
    member of the Coop (and thus vote). The fee is intentionally low
    (100 �), to allow a "one head one vote" paradigm for all local
    people. The "volume" financing of the Coop comes through different
    instruments, such as Profit Participation Certificates or Provenance
    Certificates - both of which can again be deposited for GROK credit
    limits.<br>
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:BANLkTinFVdw3aodOLGF88F89Pca+eUoKHA@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div>
        <div>
          <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br>
            </font></div>
          <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">As far as I
              remember, although I have no references to provide ( would
              need to ask Bernard Lietaer ),</font></div>
          <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">in Belgium at
              least, I heard that unless one has a special status such
              as a bank,</font></div>
          <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">one can not
              operate a currency with euro equivalence exchangeable�for
              euros, unless there is 100 percent euro backing in
              reserves, such as is the case with the german
              regio/freigeld currency called "chiemgauer"�</font><a
              moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiemgauer"
              target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiemgauer</a></div>
          <div><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">and/or
              the JAK bank in Sweden�</span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JAK_members_bank"
              target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JAK_members_bank</a></div>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    Yup, that's right. And it's why we made the provision that GROKs are
    NOT (directly) convertible back to national currency. The exciting
    thing about the GROK is that it is NOT linked to any national
    currency (= fiat money = going to crash soon), it floats in it's own
    asset-backed space, without interest, and hopefully, probably,
    without any inflation. The German Authority which oversees banks has
    given us a written reply that our concept does not require a bank
    licence. I'm still waiting for a reply to the same question from the
    Bank of England.<br>
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:BANLkTinFVdw3aodOLGF88F89Pca+eUoKHA@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div>
        <div>
          <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br>
            </font></div>
          <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">If their barter
              currency is solely for their internal local economy, with
              no possibility for exchanging for euros ( purchasing
              outside of their local economy ), I do not understand why
              they would not have it in a fiat mutual credit form, such
              as WIR, with participants choosing the percentage of their
              monetary transaction they wish to be done in mutual credit
              ( such as WIR ) ?</font></div>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    Well, who wants to change back from a stable currency like the GROK
    to a fiat money like the Euro? :)� But yes, for example if someone
    moves away. In which case, you just spend your GROKs - on groceries
    or whatever, in good time. Or there may by that time be a clearing
    institute, exchanging Frisco GROKs for Seattle GROKs or whatever. If
    you worked real hard and now have lots of GROKs you can buy any
    joint-ownership certficates (with your GROKs) which may be on offer
    within the barter ring - and then sell these for Euros. That's an
    indirect but legal way to get back into national currency if you
    really need to. And independent of that, participants in the barter
    community are free to agree a deal in which part is paid in GROKs
    and part in national currency, no problem with that.<br>
    <br>
    The WIR Swiss Franc has a 1 - 1 parity with the standard Swiss
    Franc, and the WIR Coop also has a Swiss Bank Licence.<br>
    <blockquote
      cite="mid:BANLkTinFVdw3aodOLGF88F89Pca+eUoKHA@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div>
        <div>
          <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br>
            </font></div>
          <div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><a
                moz-do-not-send="true"
                href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WIR_Bank"
                target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WIR_Bank</a></font></div>
          <div><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://wn.com/WIR_Bank"
              target="_blank">http://wn.com/WIR_Bank</a></div>
          <div><font face="Verdana"><br>
            </font></div>
          <div><font face="Verdana"><br>
            </font><br>
            <div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Apr 18, 2011 at 9:14 PM,
              Michel Bauwens <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a
                  moz-do-not-send="true"
                  href="mailto:michelsub2004@gmail.com" target="_blank">michelsub2004@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
              wrote:<br>
              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt
                0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);
                padding-left: 1ex;">
                HI Franz,<br>
                <br>
                any perspectives on this?<br>
                <br>
                Michel<br>
                <br>
                <div class="gmail_quote">
                  <div>
                    <div>On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 1:59 AM, Dante-Gabryell
                      Monson <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a
                          moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:dante.monson@gmail.com"
                          target="_blank">dante.monson@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
                      wrote:<br>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt
                    0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204,
                    204); padding-left: 1ex;">
                    <div>
                      <div>
                        <div class="gmail_quote"><span
                            style="font-family: Verdana;"><a
                              moz-do-not-send="true"
                              href="http://regional-economic-communities.info/"
                              target="_blank">http://regional-economic-communities.info/</a></span></div>
                        <div class="gmail_quote">
                          <br>
                        </div>
                        <div class="gmail_quote">( found�via open space
                          list )</div>
                        <div class="gmail_quote"><br>
                          <div class="gmail_quote">---------- Forwarded
                            message ----------<br>
                            From: <b class="gmail_sendername">Tim
                              Reeves</b> <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a
                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                href="mailto:tim.reeves@rewig.info"
                                target="_blank">tim.reeves@rewig.info</a>&gt;</span><br>
                            Date: Sun, Apr 17, 2011 at 6:19 AM<br>
                            Subject: Regional Economic Communities<br>
                            To: Tim Reeves &lt;<a moz-do-not-send="true"
                              href="mailto:tim.reeves@rewig.info"
                              target="_blank">tim.reeves@rewig.info</a>&gt;<br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            <div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#003333"> Dear
                              friends and acquaintances,<br>
                              <br>
                              I just put together a <u>one-time</u>
                              mailing list of the english speakers I
                              know (and some german speakers with
                              international connections). I'm writing to
                              let you know about the concept of Regional
                              Economic Communities, hoping that you may
                              be able to help getting it known. <font
                                size="-1"><font face="Verdana"><br>
                                  <br>
                                  The concept presents a complete � and
                                  radically new � paradigm for regional
                                  communities, linking together
                                  commercial, sustainable and social
                                  aspects. It describes a means for
                                  normal citizens to become joint owners
                                  of local, sustainably-run businesses.
                                  It then introduces a barter currency,
                                  the Grok, which is independent of
                                  national currency and covered by the
                                  jointly-owned assets.<br>
                                  <br>
                                  While thus apparently being a
                                  primarily economic paradigm, it's
                                  essence and motivation come from a
                                  spiritual perspective and in practice
                                  great value is put on the way we
                                  interact with each other, and to
                                  integrating personal growth and the
                                  furthering of interpersonal skills
                                  into the daily working life.<br>
                                  <br>
                                  The external forms have been carefully
                                  designed to be <i>practicable</i>.<br>
                                  <br>
                                  You can read all about it here: <a
                                    moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="http://regional-economic-communities.info/"
                                    target="_blank">http://regional-economic-communities.info/</a><br>
                                  <br>
                                  The first such community is currently
                                  starting up in Munich - the
                                  cooperative is founded and registered,
                                  and moving ahead swiftly towards
                                  getting the actual business side up
                                  and running. If you would like to help
                                  the concept take root in the
                                  english-speaking world, here are some
                                  things that would help:<br>
                                </font></font>
                              <ul>
                                <li>Forward this email to anyone you
                                  know who might be interested - people
                                  active in regional currencies,
                                  ecological measures, transition town,
                                  and such.</li>
                                <li>Anyone who has the possibility,
                                  please set a link to the concept
                                  website on your website, so that other
                                  interested people may find it.</li>
                                <li>Talk to friends about it, subscribe
                                  for the newsletter (do so on the
                                  website) <font size="-1"><font
                                      face="Verdana">� and</font></font>
                                  don't hesitate to contact me with
                                  questions.<br>
                                </li>
                                <li>Envision a better future for all,
                                  and practice wellwishing for all the
                                  many endeavours to achieve that aim
                                  which are now being explored.<br>
                                </li>
                              </ul>
                              <font size="-1"><font face="Verdana">The
                                  quality of the time in which we live
                                  demonstrates an exceptional
                                  development of consciousness. It grows
                                  with every individual who is willing
                                  to tread the paths of personal</font></font><font
                                size="-1"><font face="Verdana"> growth</font></font><font
                                size="-1"><font face="Verdana"> and
                                  systemic evolution. May it bestow us
                                  all with more cooperative and
                                  appreciative lives � paving the way to
                                  a future which we can truly look
                                  forward to.<br>
                                </font></font><br>
                              <div> <span style="font-size: 10pt;
                                  color: rgb(185, 116, 74); font-family:
                                  Segoe UI,Frutiger Next,DejaVu
                                  Sans,Bitstream Vera Sans,Lucida
                                  Grande,Lucida
Mac,Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular,sans-serif;"><b>With

                                    thanks and warm regards,</b><br>
                                  <br>
                                  <b style="font-size: 12pt;
                                    letter-spacing: 1px;">Tim Reeves</b><br>
                                  <br>
                                </span> <span style="font-size: 9pt;
                                  color: rgb(152, 80, 35); font-family:
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                                  Sans,Bitstream Vera Sans,Lucida
                                  Grande,Lucida
Mac,Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva,Swiss,SunSans-Regular,sans-serif;">Flurstra�e

                                  10, D-85221 Dachau<br>
                                  <br>
                                  Tel. 08131 - 273 653�� Fax 08131 - 273
                                  654<br>
                                  <span style="font-size: 6px;"><br>
                                  </span> Email: <a
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                                    href="mailto:tim.reeves@rewig.info"
                                    target="_blank">tim.reeves@rewig.info</a><br>
                                  <span style="font-size: 6px;"><br>
                                  </span> Skype: timothy.reeves (mit
                                  Webcam)<br>
                                  <br>
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                                    alt="ReeComm-Logo" height="92"
                                    width="200"><br>
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                                    target="_blank">regionale-wirtschaftsgemeinschaft.info</a>���

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                                    target="_blank">regional-economic-communities.info</a>���

                                  <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="http://rewig-muenchen.de/"
                                    target="_blank">rewig-muenchen.de</a><br>
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