[P2P-F] eco-systemic supply chains are on their way

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And within the TIMN framework, if I understand it correctly, even the
nature of the TIM aspects is dialectically conditioned by their
relationship to the commons as a new dominant factor emerges.

On Thu, Aug 9, 2018 at 10:55 AM, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com>
wrote:

> I don't really share the pessimistic assessment of James,
>
> for all measures that I know, the commons are in pretty much exponential
> uptake
>
> the issue is more that the commons are captured by capital, but again,
> given historical precedents of phase change, this is to be expected,
>
> Michel
>
> On Wed, Aug 8, 2018 at 6:13 PM David Ronfeldt <ronfeldt at icloud.com> wrote:
>
>> Many thanks for your reply
>>
>> I see points I agree with, notably that "those who represent the
>> interests of the commons are on the back foot” for all the reasons you
>> name. Moreover, for now it’s indeed true that "markets and governments are
>> impositions on the commons” — that’s long been so, but the rise of the
>> info-age network form may change that, if TIMN is correct. I also generally
>> agree that "the possibilities of visionary leadership for decentralized
>> commons through public ledgers are thus far unable to generate network
>> effects for the public good” — though I’m not all sure what that means
>> specifically.
>>
>> However, I must note that you seem to misunderstand me/TIMN when you say
>> that the kind of blockchain project you want "does not involve isolating
>> the commons as a separate unit from markets and governments as you [I]
>> suggest, since these are in fact not independent sectors but actually vital
>> parts of the underlying commons”. But I have never conceived of the commons
>> as a “separate unit”. Distinct and boundaried, yes, but separate no.
>> Whatever the best words for what I think TIMN implies, they are words that
>> should apply to all four TIMN sectors, as aspects of its general system
>> dynamics. All four forms are vital to a quadriform society; each is
>> distinct and different; independent to a degree, but also interdependent;
>> and they interact constantly.
>>
>> I have additional overarching comments as well, but I’ll put them in my
>> reply to Michel. I’m sensing that we have in mind very different concepts
>> of the commons sector, more different than I had thought. P2P’s concept
>> seems geared primarily to economic  matters, whereas i think TIMN’s isn’t.
>> More on that later.
>>
>>
>> ===
>>
>> > On Aug 6, 2018, at 8:08 PM, jbquilligan3 at charter.net wrote:
>> >
>> > well, David, that would be a great objective but the evidence indicates
>> that blockchain is well on its way to becoming a central management tool of
>> the capitalist economy
>> >
>> > once again those who represent the interests of the commons are on the
>> back foot, have no political portfolio, lack financing and generally do not
>> have an integrated plan
>> >
>> > indeed, markets and governments are impositions on the commons, but the
>> countervailing power of the commons is not in seeing the commons as a
>> dialectical synthesis which results from and/or works in
>> counter-distinction to markets and governments
>> >
>> > our theorists are so thoroughly conditioned by the liberal tradition
>> that the possibilities of visionary leadership for  decentralized commons
>> through public ledgers are thus far unable to generate network effects for
>> the public good
>> >
>> > I will be first in line for a blockchain which links the resource
>> thresholds of an ecology with the allocations for meeting the needs of the
>> population within that ecology, but this project does not involve isolating
>> the commons as a separate unit from markets and governments as you suggest,
>> since these are in fact not independent sectors but actually vital parts of
>> the underlying commons
>> >
>> > isn't it really about developing a blockchain that transforms markets
>> and governments back to their proto-distributional functions for the
>> sustainability of the commons in meeting human needs?
>> >
>> > frankly I've not seen a single blockchain plan that actually links
>> resources with population, which leads me to believe that the opportunity
>> for a commons blockchain is rapidly slipping away if not already entirely
>> lost
>> >
>> > what I do see is a few commoners creating circles of self-sufficiency
>> while a crusade of Libertarians marches to the slogan, Onward Venture
>> Capital
>> >
>> > -----------------------------------------
>> >
>> > From: "David Ronfeldt"
>> > To: "Michel Bauwens"
>> > Cc: "David Ronfeldt", "James Bernard Quilligan", "Alex Pazaitis",
>> "Sarah Grace Manski", "xavier rizos", "Xavier BlaqSwans", "Andrea
>> Fumagalli", "Alex Foti", "jose ramos", "p2p-foundation"
>> > Sent: Monday August 6 2018 6:29:16PM
>> > Subject: Re: eco-systemic supply chains are on their way
>> >
>> > Your email refers to an article about applying blockchain to business
>> actors in a market economy. What interests me far more is the nature of
>> actors who will end up in a new commons sector, possibly after migrating
>> there from the old public and private sectors. Will blockchain-like methods
>> give them advantages? Enough to help form and sustain a distinct commons
>> sector?
>> >
>> > As you know, I think good candidates for this sector will come from
>> health, education, environment, and welfare activities and related
>> insurance entities, following huge reorganizations. A while back I saw an
>> article about blockchain’s promise for insurance, observing among other
>> points that "Blockchain adoption has the power to transition new and
>> existing models of insurance, including P2P insurance, parametric insurance
>> and microinsurance, into a new digital age.”
>> >
>> > The article you circulated about “V-form networks” implies improvements
>> for the market sector. Fine with me. But I’d sure like to see lots more
>> about competitive advantages for a commons sector vis a vis the old public
>> and private sectors, along with cooperative advantages within and without
>> this prospective commons sector. At least I’ve seen few references to using
>> blockchain/ holochain/ whatever in hospitals and schools.
>> >
>> > More generally, i shall hope that this prospective new commons sector
>> (which will be decades in the making) focuses on being itself, the commons
>> sector, and not on transforming all of society. Many problems we have now
>> stem from the public and private sectors trying to be so much more than
>> they should be, distorting our society (including by squeezing and
>> burdening the family /community /household sector). All of which helps
>> explain why I’d say politicians like Bernie Sanders and Alexandra
>> Ocasio-Perez would be well-advised to cease calling for socialism across
>> society as a whole and instead call for socialism in one sector, since the
>> commons sector should meet many of their values and principles. TIMN is not
>> a socialist theory, but it could commend what I just suggested.
>> >
>> > Onward.
>> >
>> >
>> > ===
>> >
>> > > On Aug 5, 2018, at 8:19 AM, Michel Bauwens <michelsub2004 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > dear James,
>> > >
>> > > in the context of our study, https://www.foprop.org/
>> stewarding-material-commons
>> > /> >
>> > > perhaps this context is precisely what you could offer us ? I am also
>> still in particular need of a good explanation, for a separate 'explanatory
>> box' of the 3 thermodynamic laws,
>> > >
>> > > Michel
>> > >
>> > > On Sun, Aug 5, 2018 at 2:31 AM <jbquilligan3 at charter.net> wrote:
>> > > beyond earthquake, Michel
>> > >
>> > > the global political economy of supply chains restructured by
>> blockchain will be in full operation when emergency rationing is instituted
>> about 2040-2045 due to swelling populations, diminishing levels of arable
>> land, water, fossil fuels and rare minerals and the debilitating effects of
>> climate change
>> > >
>> > > -----------------------------------------
>> > >
>> > > From: "Michel Bauwens"
>> > > To: "Alex Pazaitis", "David Ronfeldt", "Sarah Grace Manski", "xavier
>> rizos", "Xavier BlaqSwans", "Andrea Fumagalli", "Alex Foti", "jose ramos",
>> "p2p-foundation"
>> > > Cc:
>> > > Sent: Saturday August 4 2018 3:27:49AM
>> > > Subject: eco-systemic supply chains are on their way
>> > >
>> > > I hope this can impress some people that are still on the sidelines
>> of this major earthquake, to understand the significance of what is
>> occuring right now, a fundamental re-ordering of the capitalist economy
>> under new models:
>> > >
>> > > first of all, see this article, that shows successfull blockchain
>> trials for supply chains, https://which-50.com/commbank-
>> and-logistics-giants-complete-blockchain-trade-from-
>> regional-victoria-to-germany/?
>> > /> >
>> > > and what it all means in terms of industrial structures see the
>> article quoted below,
>> > >
>> > > but in fact, I don't think their analysis goes far enough, because in
>> the ethereum networks, corporates are already subsumed to a eco-system
>> consisting not just of companies, but of a multitude of other players,
>> including lots of single individuals:
>> > >
>> > > QUOTE
>> > >
>> > > Blockchain-Based Corporate V-Networks
>> > > = "V-form networks consist of a number of fully independent companies
>> that effectively operate as one vertically integrated company through
>> blockchain technology". [1]
>> > >
>> > > Contents [hide]
>> > > • 1 Contextual Citation
>> > > • 2 Description
>> > > • 3 Example
>> > > • 3.1 The IBM and Maersk TradeTech
>> > > Contextual Citation[edit]
>> > > "A blockchain economy will have more, smaller firms linked together
>> by protocols. .. It’s worth pointing out that these networks are inherently
>> global, and any regulatory questions global as well."
>> > > - Chris Berg, Sinclair Davidson and Jason Potts [2]
>> > >
>> > > Description[edit]
>> > > "The Nobel laureate Oliver Williamson distinguishes between U-form
>> companies and M-form companies.
>> > > Traditional U-form companies are unitary — their units are divided by
>> business process (for instance, accounting, human resources, component
>> manufacturing, assembly) and are not treated as separate cost centres.
>> > > M-form companies are multidivisional — their units are self-contained
>> divisions that report profits and losses to an umbrella central body.
>> They’re fully owned by a parent company, but they tend to have their own
>> business services (accounting and human resources departments, for
>> instance) and even market relationships.
>> > > But now we see a new corporate form — the V-form network — made
>> possible because thanks to the application of distributed ledger technology
>> to supply chain problems.
>> > > These V-form networks consist of a number of fully independent
>> companies that effectively operate as one vertically integrated company
>> through blockchain technology, coordinated and supplied by a third party.
>> > > This is a big change to the nature of the firm. We can already see
>> V-form networks in the real world. They date as far back as January. It is
>> surprising the economics community haven’t noticed them yet.
>> > > ...
>> > >
>> > > Blockchains can work to coordinate supply chains without the need for
>> either (traditional) vertical integration or regulation. The vertical
>> integration is outsourced to a distributed ledger. The blockchain provides
>> the managerial service that coordinates each ‘unit’ (that is, firm) in the
>> supply chain.
>> > > Regulators in any country can deal any firm in the supply chain as if
>> it was a small unit of a larger, global company.
>> > > Each firm in the supply chain get the benefits of vertical
>> integration through a network rather than a hierarchy.
>> > >
>> > > ...
>> > >
>> > > In the V-form network, the blockchain’s token establishes the
>> consortium, and incentivizes cooperative behaviour.
>> > > The token also serves to move rents around the network. In this way,
>> the blockchain provides a market mechanism to solve the sort of bargaining
>> problems described by another Nobel laureate, Ronald Coase, that may occur
>> as the network operates.
>> > > Outsourced vertical integration could be applied to many industries
>> that are now integrated. Energy firms that currently integrate the
>> exploration, production, generation, and retail of electricity might be
>> better decomposed, with blockchains and tokens taking the place of head
>> offices. The token economy, rather than energy regulators, could make
>> decisions about the distribution of rents around the network." (
>> https://medium.com/cryptoeconomics-australia/outsourcing-vertical-
>> integration-introducing-the-v-form-network-78e1aa93a814)
>> > /> >
>> > > Example[edit]
>> > > The IBM and Maersk TradeTech[edit]
>> > > Chris Berg, Sinclair Davidson and Jason Potts:
>> > > "Two weeks into 2018, IBM and the shipping giant Maersk announced a
>> joint venture to develop a digital supply chain management system on their
>> Hyperledger blockchain platform. Hyperledger is a private blockchain which
>> requires permission to access.
>> > > In a previous Cryptoeconomics piece, we described how international
>> trade is an information problem. As goods are shipped around the world,
>> they are accompanied by information — really stacks of paperwork — that
>> describe their provenance, destinations, regulatory and tax liabilities and
>> so on.
>> > > In the IBM-Maersk system, each firm and bureaucracy in the supply
>> chain — producers, shippers, port authorities, regulators, importers,
>> retailers — will access and update a shared blockchain ledger containing
>> all the information needed by each organisation.
>> > > And each organisation would have access to that information
>> everywhere, ensuring complete visibility on where goods are in the world
>> and which economic and regulatory hurdles they next need to overcome." (
>> https://medium.com/cryptoeconomics-australia/outsourcing-vertical-
>> integration-introducing-the-v-form-network-78e1aa93a814)
>> > /> >
>> > > --
>> > > P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net -
>> http://blog.p2pfoundation.net
>> > >
>> > > Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss:
>> http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation
>> > /> >
>> > > Updates: http://del.icio.us/mbauwens; http://friendfeed.com/mbauwens;
>> http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens
>> > /> >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net -
>> http://blog.p2pfoundation.net
>> > >
>> > > Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss:
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>> > /> >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>>
>>
>
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