<br>Una de las cosas que quería decir es que igual ya no es urgente la consulta ahora que sabemos que a partir de noviembre tenemos un grupo nuevo de 3 bolsas que tiene pensado llegar hasta 6. Así que por mí no hay prisa, cuando os venga bien.<br>
<br>Besos<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">El 28 de octubre de 2010 14:45, <a href="mailto:manulopezruiz@nodo50.org">manulopezruiz@nodo50.org</a> <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:manulopezruiz@nodo50.org">manulopezruiz@nodo50.org</a>&gt;</span> escribió:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">

  
    
    
  
  <div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
    Hola...<br>
    <br>
    Parece que está difícil que consigamos vernos hoy. El lunes me
    parece bien. Creo que Alejandra también puede. Queda saber si Liber
    ya habrá vuelto del viaje.<br>
    <br>
    Yo sigo pensando que es necesario enviar una propuesta a los grupos,
    si bien modificada, recogiendo las aportaciones de Liber y de Ale o
    las que puedan ir surgiendo. Lo único es que si nos reunimos el
    lunes y decidimos mandarla, llegará el martes por la mañana y mucha
    gente se va a presentar en la reunión de la noche sin haberla leído
    o sin haberla digerido. En esas condiciones me parece que sí puede
    generarse una confusión importante. Eso sin contar con los grupos
    que puedan haberse reunido el martes pasado.<br>
    <br>
    Además, con estos plazos hay poco margen para que la ronda de
    llamadas a los grupos que teníamos que hacer para preguntar por la
    deuda de acciones colectivas del 2009 se aproveche para responder a
    alguna duda puntual que pueda surgir sobre la consulta. Teniendo en
    cuenta todo lo anterior, yo daría por muerta la pretensión de
    obtener una respuesta en la asamblea general de noviembre y
    trasladaría todo este aparato a finales de mes, después del
    encuentro de &#39;Todo lo que siempre quiso saber...&#39;.<br>
    <br>
    Pero, vaya, si os parece lo discutimos el lunes.<br>
    <br>
    Salud y besos.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    El 28/10/2010 13:09, Angela Alvarez escribió:
    <div><div></div><div class="h5"><blockquote type="cite">
      <div>ya sé que es puente y que os iréis, pero lo mismo volvéis el
        lunes no muy tarde...</div>
      <div> </div>
      <div>yo podría, quién más podría el lunes por la tarde?<br>
        <br>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_quote">El 28 de octubre de 2010 12:52, Libertad
        Bullejos Jiménez <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:huria22@gmail.com" target="_blank">huria22@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
        escribió:<br>
        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">
          <div>Yo me tengo que ir a las 19.30 y puedo quedar a partir de
            las 18.00, sé que es poco tiempo pero no doy más de mí
            misma, me voy mañana de viaje y esta tarde tengo claustro y
            recados varios... además estoy teniendo con problemas de
            insomnio y me va a dar un infarto!!!!</div>
          <div> </div>
          <div>Cómo lo hacemos?</div>
          <div> </div>
          <div>Os parece muy mal que dejemos la reu pa la semana que
            viene? El martes por la tarde prontito? Estoy un poco al
            límite pero si os parece muy mal yo hoy hago malabares para
            veros en algún momento...</div>
          <div> </div>
          <div>Besos </div>
          <div> </div>
          <div> </div>
          <div><br>
             </div>
          <div class="gmail_quote">El 28 de octubre de 2010 11:19,
            Angela Alvarez <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:angela.alvarez.sch@gmail.com" target="_blank">angela.alvarez.sch@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
            escribió:
            <div>
              <div><br>
                <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">
                  <div>holitas,</div>
                  <div> </div>
                  <div>Lo de mi casa sigue en pié, pero yo hasta las
                    19:30 o las 20:00 no puedo llegar, es lo que
                    tiene el trabajo de oficina!, así que si queréis
                    quedar antes y yo me uno después, pues podéis quedar
                    en otro sitio.</div>
                  <div> </div>
                  <div>Besos!<br>
                    <br>
                  </div>
                  <div class="gmail_quote">El 28 de octubre de 2010
                    09:31, Alejandra Goded <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:aleleola@gmail.com" target="_blank">aleleola@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
                    escribió:
                    <div>
                      <div><br>
                        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">Vale, en casa de Ángela a las 18:30?<br>
                          <br>
                          Gracias por tu comprensión, Dani, pero la
                          verdad es que yo me he dado cuenta de que
                          había que darle una vuelta más a lo que
                          tenemos que decir y quería proponer algún
                          cambio (sobre todo ahora que vamos a tener un
                          grupo nuevo de 3 bolsas... y contando)<br>
                          <br>
                          Besos<br>
                          <br>
                          Ale<br>
                          <br>
                          <div class="gmail_quote">El 26 de octubre de
                            2010 19:13, Angela Alvarez <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:angela.alvarez.sch@gmail.com" target="_blank">angela.alvarez.sch@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
                            escribió:
                            <div>
                              <div><br>
                                <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">
                                  <div>toca mi casa!</div>
                                  <div> </div>
                                  <div>pequeña, pero como no habrá
                                    despliegue de ordenadores pues
                                    cabemos.</div>
                                  <div> </div>
                                  <div>C/ Narciso Serra, 9, 4º puerta 6.</div>
                                  <div> Metro Menendez Pelayo</div>
                                  <div> </div>
                                  <div>Besos!<br>
                                  </div>
                                  <div class="gmail_quote">El 26 de
                                    octubre de 2010 18:46, <a href="mailto:manulopezruiz@nodo50.org" target="_blank">manulopezruiz@nodo50.org</a>
                                    <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:manulopezruiz@nodo50.org" target="_blank">manulopezruiz@nodo50.org</a>&gt;</span>
                                    escribió:
                                    <div>
                                      <div><br>
                                        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">
                                          <div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">Contesto a lo
                                            urgente ahora y dejo para
                                            esta noche lo importante. Si
                                            os parece bien quedamos el
                                            jueves. Donde digáis.<br>
                                            <br>
                                            Salud y besos.<br>
                                            <br>
                                            <br>
                                            El 26/10/2010 17:23,
                                            Libertad Bullejos Jiménez
                                            escribió:
                                            <div>
                                              <div>
                                                <blockquote type="cite">por
                                                  mí el jueves bien, si
                                                  no es muy tarde que el
                                                  viernes me levanto a
                                                  las 6 de la mañana...<br>
                                                  <br>
                                                  Bss<br>
                                                  <br>
                                                  <div class="gmail_quote">El
                                                    26 de octubre de
                                                    2010 17:04, Angela
                                                    Alvarez <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:angela.alvarez.sch@gmail.com" target="_blank">angela.alvarez.sch@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
                                                    escribió:<br>
                                                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">
                                                      <div>Atisbo el
                                                        consenso al
                                                        menos en lo de
                                                        quedar.</div>
                                                      <div> </div>
                                                      <div>Yo tengo una
                                                        reu el miércoles
                                                        y saldré tipo
                                                        19:00... pero el
                                                        jueves lo tengo
                                                        bien.</div>
                                                      <div> </div>
                                                      <div>Besos!<br>
                                                        <br>
                                                      </div>
                                                      <div class="gmail_quote">El
                                                        26 de octubre de
                                                        2010 16:41,
                                                        Alejandra Goded
                                                        <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:aleleola@gmail.com" target="_blank">aleleola@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
                                                        escribió:
                                                        <div>
                                                          <div><br>
                                                          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">Vale,
                                                          no me viene
                                                          muy bien
                                                          quedar esta
                                                          semana, pero
                                                          entiendo que
                                                          hay que
                                                          matizar
                                                          algunas de las
                                                          cosas que
                                                          vamos a decir
                                                          y que conviene
                                                          revisarlas un
                                                          poco primero o
                                                          directamente
                                                          no decirlas,
                                                          así que por mí
                                                          podemos quedar
                                                          miércoles,
                                                          jueves o
                                                          viernes por la
                                                          tarde.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          El miércoles a
                                                          las 20:30 me
                                                          tengo que ir,
                                                          así que
                                                          tendría que
                                                          ser pronto. <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Qué tal tenéis
                                                          la semana el
                                                          resto?<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <div class="gmail_quote">El
                                                          26 de octubre
                                                          de 2010 00:01,
                                                          Libertad
                                                          Bullejos
                                                          Jiménez <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:huria22@gmail.com" target="_blank">huria22@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
                                                          escribió:
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div><br>
                                                          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">Buenas,
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          La verdad es
                                                          que yo me he
                                                          quedado un
                                                          poco bloqueada
                                                          por como se ha
                                                          desarrollado
                                                          todo... el
                                                          viernes
                                                          después de la
                                                          reunión estuve
                                                          charlando con
                                                          Dani y me
                                                          surgieron
                                                          dudas sobre lo
                                                          que íbamos a
                                                          hacer sobre
                                                          todo porque me
                                                          pareció que
                                                          nos había
                                                          faltado otro
                                                          tipo de
                                                          visión; pienso
                                                          que los que
                                                          estabamos en
                                                          la reu tenemos
                                                          tendencia a
                                                          fijarnos más
                                                          en la cuestión
                                                          de que cuadren
                                                          las cuentas y
                                                          esto sigo
                                                          pensando que
                                                          es importante
                                                          pero
                                                          encontrando un
                                                          equilibrio con
                                                          otras, y da la
                                                          casualidad de
                                                          que justo el
                                                          que faltaba es
                                                          el aporta una
                                                          visión
                                                          distinta. No
                                                          pienso que
                                                          ninguna de las
                                                          dos visiones
                                                          sea la
                                                          &quot;buena&quot;, de
                                                          hecho pienso
                                                          que debe ser
                                                          un equilibrio
                                                          entre las dos,
                                                          pero es que el
                                                          otro día
                                                          estábamos sólo
                                                          los
                                                          &quot;contables&quot; de
                                                          la comisión (y
                                                          esto lo digo
                                                          con cariño,
                                                          que nadie se
                                                          ofenda porfi).
                                                          Por eso
                                                          después de la
                                                          charla le dije
                                                          a Dani que
                                                          mandara un
                                                          mail
                                                          planteando las
                                                          dudas y
                                                          después a
                                                          venido lo
                                                          demás... y la
                                                          verdad es que
                                                          tampoco sé muy
                                                          bien como se
                                                          sigue ahora...
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Entiendo que
                                                          resulte
                                                          chocante que
                                                          después de una
                                                          decisión
                                                          tomada ocurra
                                                          esto pero
                                                          también
                                                          entiendo que
                                                          el objetivo es
                                                          hacer lo mejor
                                                          para el Bah, y
                                                          como a mí me
                                                          han surgido
                                                          dudas por eso
                                                          me pareció
                                                          bien que se
                                                          plantearan...
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Sigo pensando
                                                          que todo esto
                                                          es mejor
                                                          hablarlo en
                                                          persona que
                                                          por mail que
                                                          se malentiende
                                                          todo, pero
                                                          vosotros
                                                          diréis...<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Besotes<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <div class="gmail_quote">El
                                                          25 de octubre
                                                          de 2010 23:09,
                                                          Angela Alvarez
                                                          <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:angela.alvarez.sch@gmail.com" target="_blank">angela.alvarez.sch@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
                                                          escribió:
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div><br>
                                                          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">
                                                          <div>hola
                                                          amigos,</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>hay
                                                          varias cosas
                                                          interesantes
                                                          que comentar,
                                                          pero creo que
                                                          eso lo podemos
                                                          hacer con una
                                                          caña delante
                                                          cuando
                                                          queramos, de
                                                          momento hay
                                                          que decidir
                                                          que hacemos
                                                          mañana.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>Parece
                                                          que Alejandra
                                                          y Andrés tiene
                                                          claro en
                                                          seguir
                                                          adelante con
                                                          la decisión
                                                          del viernes,
                                                          Liber tiene
                                                          sus dudas... y
                                                          yo por mi
                                                          parte, después
                                                          de leer los
                                                          argumentos y
                                                          darle unas
                                                          vueltas sigo
                                                          pensando que
                                                          se trata de un
                                                          tema bastante
                                                          objetivo y
                                                          concreto, es
                                                          una situación
                                                          que no se
                                                          puede mantener
                                                          en el largo
                                                          plazo y sobre
                                                          la que hay que
                                                          tomar una
                                                          decisión. No
                                                          obstante, creo
                                                          que hay que
                                                          plantearlo con
                                                          mucha calma y
                                                          sin darle
                                                          demasiado
                                                          bombo para que
                                                          nadie se ponga
                                                          nervioso y
                                                          esto no se
                                                          convierta en
                                                          el único punto
                                                          de los tres
                                                          próximos
                                                          meses.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>En
                                                          conclusión,
                                                          desde mi punto
                                                          de vista, creo
                                                          que mañana
                                                          Andrés debería
                                                          mandar el mail
                                                          que quedó en
                                                          enviar, eso
                                                          sí, con el
                                                          tono más suave
                                                          posible, sin
                                                          alarmas y el
                                                          resto llamar a
                                                          los grupos que
                                                          nos
                                                          repartimos.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>Ummm,
                                                          como no sé
                                                          mucho de rollo
                                                          asambleario
                                                          pues no sé
                                                          como se sigue
                                                          ahora, no sé
                                                          si en una
                                                          comisión se
                                                          vota o no, o
                                                          hay que llegar
                                                          a la
                                                          unanimidad o
                                                          qué... pero sí
                                                          creo que Liber
                                                          y Dani
                                                          deberíais
                                                          volver a
                                                          manifestaros
                                                          al respecto a
                                                          ver si podemos
                                                          llegar a algún
                                                          punto.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>Freakonomicsbesos!</div>
                                                          <div><br>
                                                          <br>
                                                           </div>
                                                          <div class="gmail_quote">El
                                                          25 de octubre
                                                          de 2010 18:10,
                                                          Alejandra
                                                          Goded <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:aleleola@gmail.com" target="_blank">aleleola@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
                                                          escribió:
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div><br>
                                                          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">Queridos
                                                          papá pitufo y
                                                          freakonomics:<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Creo que esta
                                                          comisión es
                                                          autónoma y
                                                          soberana para
                                                          tomar
                                                          decisiones y
                                                          que la reunión
                                                          del otro día
                                                          debe ser
                                                          considerada
                                                          decisoria. No
                                                          me parece
                                                          justo que se
                                                          ponga en
                                                          cuestión esta
                                                          autonomía.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Creo también
                                                          que presuponer
                                                          que los grupos
                                                          sentirán
                                                          frustración al
                                                          recibir
                                                          nuestro
                                                          mensaje es
                                                          algo
                                                          aventurado y
                                                          que paralizar
                                                          las consultas
                                                          que creemos
                                                          necesarias
                                                          porque a lo
                                                          mejor parece
                                                          ser que pueden
                                                          hacer sentir
                                                          mal a algunas
                                                          personas no
                                                          creo que esté
                                                          suficientemente
                                                          justificado.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          En cuanto a
                                                          los
                                                          argumentos,
                                                          entiendo que
                                                          hay que
                                                          preguntarse si
                                                          es el momento
                                                          adecuado para
                                                          lanzar el
                                                          mensaje, pero
                                                          a la larga me
                                                          parece más
                                                          adecuado
                                                          hacerlo ahora
                                                          a pesar de que
                                                          la cooperativa
                                                          quiere
                                                          centrarse en
                                                          temas más
                                                          políticos
                                                          porque estamos
                                                          a tiempo de
                                                          arreglarlo
                                                          ahora que es
                                                          un problema
                                                          pequeño. 
                                                          Además,
                                                          queremos
                                                          facilitar la
                                                          decisión
                                                          ofrenciendo
                                                          opciones
                                                          claras para
                                                          que no se
                                                          alargue
                                                          demasiado el
                                                          debate en los
                                                          grupos. Y si
                                                          algún grupo
                                                          quiere
                                                          alargarse más,
                                                          debemos dejar
                                                          que ejerzan su
                                                          autonomía y
                                                          decidan ellos
                                                          qué temas les
                                                          parecen más
                                                          importantes.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Pienso que se
                                                          debe advertir
                                                          cuando antes a
                                                          los grupos de
                                                          que aunque no
                                                          se haya
                                                          decidido fijar
                                                          el número de
                                                          bolsas
                                                          (cuestión que
                                                          tiene de
                                                          política y de
                                                          organizativa a
                                                          partes
                                                          iguales) si se
                                                          sigue haciendo
                                                          unilateralmente
                                                          puede
                                                          repercutir en
                                                          las cuentas
                                                          que con tanto
                                                          esfuerzo se
                                                          aprobaron en
                                                          el anterior
                                                          plenario y eso
                                                          sí que puede
                                                          ser
                                                          frustrante. Si
                                                          no se advierte
                                                          ahora, los
                                                          grupos pueden
                                                          seguir bajando
                                                          hasta que el
                                                          problema se
                                                          vuelva más
                                                          difícil de
                                                          manejar.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          De todas
                                                          formas, no le
                                                          descubrimos
                                                          América a
                                                          nadie si
                                                          hacemos notar
                                                          que el tema
                                                          del número de
                                                          bolsas sigue
                                                          pendiente de
                                                          cerrar.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Si lo creéis
                                                          necesario,
                                                          podemos hacer
                                                          otra reunión,
                                                          pero recalco
                                                          que me parece
                                                          injusto y que
                                                          preferiría que
                                                          no se
                                                          convirtiera en
                                                          una costumbre,
                                                          aunque acepto
                                                          que puede
                                                          haber matices
                                                          en esta
                                                          cuestión en
                                                          los que no
                                                          hemos caído.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Besos<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <div class="gmail_quote">El
                                                          25 de octubre
                                                          de 2010 17:29,
                                                          <a href="mailto:manulopezruiz@nodo50.org" target="_blank">manulopezruiz@nodo50.org</a>
                                                          <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:manulopezruiz@nodo50.org" target="_blank">manulopezruiz@nodo50.org</a>&gt;</span>
                                                          escribió:
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div><br>
                                                          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">
                                                          <div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">No
                                                          es que quiera
                                                          ignorar a
                                                          pitufo gruñón,
                                                          es que el
                                                          sábado no
                                                          consulté el
                                                          correo y el
                                                          domingo me
                                                          quedé bastante
                                                          frustrado al
                                                          leer el
                                                          mensaje de
                                                          Dani. He
                                                          preferido
                                                          contar hasta
                                                          veinte, pero
                                                          Ángela ha
                                                          escrito y a mí
                                                          no me ha dado
                                                          tiempo de
                                                          llegar más que
                                                          a doce o
                                                          trece.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          En primer
                                                          lugar, me han
                                                          llamado la
                                                          atención los
                                                          tiempos
                                                          verbales. No
                                                          es &#39;vais a
                                                          preguntar no
                                                          sé qué a los
                                                          grupos&#39;. Es,
                                                          más bien,
                                                          &#39;vamos a
                                                          preguntar&#39; a
                                                          los grupos.
                                                          Quiero decir:
                                                          va a ser una
                                                          pregunta que
                                                          formula la
                                                          comisión de la
                                                          que formamos
                                                          parte, Dani
                                                          incluido. Si
                                                          Dani no forma
                                                          parte de la
                                                          comisión, no
                                                          entiendo el
                                                          propósito de
                                                          su mensaje.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Más adelante
                                                          Dani escribe
                                                          &#39;no conozco
                                                          exactamente la
                                                          consulta&#39;,
                                                          pero sin
                                                          embargo la
                                                          califica de
                                                          &#39;muy técnica&#39;.
                                                          (Ojo, no solo
                                                          de &#39;técnica&#39;,
                                                          sino de &#39;muy
                                                          técnica&#39;). A
                                                          continuación
                                                          comenta que la
                                                          consulta
                                                          produciría la
                                                          sensación de
                                                          que las
                                                          cuentas del
                                                          BAH! son algo
                                                          muy
                                                          complicado.
                                                          Pues bien,
                                                          resulta que
                                                          las cuentas
                                                          del BAH! sí
                                                          son, al menos,
                                                          bastante
                                                          complicadas.
                                                          Tanto como
                                                          para necesitar
                                                          de una
                                                          comisión.
                                                          Tanto como
                                                          para necesitar
                                                          un grupo
                                                          humano que
                                                          vino a dar
                                                          relevo a otro
                                                          grupo que
                                                          reconocía
                                                          estar
                                                          quemándose.
                                                          Tanto como
                                                          para que el
                                                          relevo tuviera
                                                          que ser
                                                          gradual,
                                                          incluyendo
                                                          reuniones de
                                                          formación.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Ángela ya ha
                                                          explicado en
                                                          buena medida,
                                                          en que
                                                          consiste la
                                                          consulta que
                                                          acordamos
                                                          hacer. Baste
                                                          por ahora
                                                          recordar que
                                                          durante la
                                                          reunión apenas
                                                          le dedicamos
                                                          un minuto a
                                                          analizar si
                                                          este era un
                                                          tema sólo en
                                                          apariencia
                                                          político. A
                                                          todas las
                                                          personas que
                                                          participamos
                                                          en la reunión
                                                          nos pareció
                                                          bastante
                                                          evidente que
                                                          no. Podemos
                                                          habernos
                                                          equivocado,
                                                          claro, pero
                                                          estamos
                                                          hablando de
                                                          asuntos como
                                                          la cuota, el
                                                          porcentaje
                                                          cubierto por
                                                          las acciones
                                                          colectivas, el
                                                          uso general de
                                                          los fondos o
                                                          el numero
                                                          total de
                                                          bolsas de la
                                                          cooperativa.
                                                          Descubrir que
                                                          a veces son
                                                          dignos de un
                                                          plenario y a
                                                          veces son
                                                          asuntos muy
                                                          técnicos que
                                                          pueden
                                                          resolverse sin
                                                          ni siquiera
                                                          una consulta a
                                                          la asamblea
                                                          general quizá
                                                          podría
                                                          resultarle
                                                          frustrante
                                                          para una parte
                                                          de la
                                                          cooperativa.
                                                          Hablo en
                                                          condicional,
                                                          en futuro,
                                                          (nuevamente
                                                          los  tiempos
                                                          verbales) no
                                                          me atrevo a
                                                          erigirme en
                                                          interprete de
                                                          los
                                                          sentimientos
                                                          de un grupo de
                                                          alrededor de
                                                          doscientas
                                                          personas de
                                                          las cuales
                                                          igual no
                                                          conozco a la
                                                          mitad.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Lo que sí me
                                                          resulta
                                                          indudablemente
                                                          frustrante es
                                                          asistir a las
                                                          reuniones de
                                                          mi comisión,
                                                          exprimir mis
                                                          energías y mi
                                                          saber hacer
                                                          técnico y
                                                          organizativo
                                                          para que luego
                                                          venga alguien
                                                          con malos
                                                          modos a
                                                          intentar
                                                          marcarme la
                                                          línea política
                                                          por correo
                                                          electrónico al
                                                          mismo tiempo
                                                          que reconoce
                                                          no saber bien
                                                          de qué va el
                                                          asunto. Aquí
                                                          si escribo en
                                                          presente de
                                                          indicativo,
                                                          primera
                                                          persona del
                                                          singular,
                                                          porque sé de
                                                          lo que hablo.
                                                          En cualquier
                                                          caso, que todo
                                                          este episodio
                                                          me resulte
                                                          algo
                                                          frustrante es
                                                          lo de menos.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Me estoy
                                                          acordando de
                                                          aquella chica,
                                                          en otro
                                                          colectivo, que
                                                          ante
                                                          determinada
                                                          resolución de
                                                          la asamblea
                                                          dijo que &#39;se
                                                          sentía
                                                          agredida&#39; por
                                                          la decisión.
                                                          Los
                                                          sentimientos
                                                          me parecen un
                                                          detalle digno
                                                          de mención y
                                                          de ser tomado
                                                          en cuenta,
                                                          pero no me
                                                          parecen un
                                                          criterio
                                                          orientación
                                                          válido para
                                                          tomar
                                                          decisiones en
                                                          una asamblea.
                                                          Ahí, pienso
                                                          yo, hacen
                                                          falta
                                                          criterios
                                                          políticos y
                                                          técnicos, es
                                                          decir,
                                                          racionales.
                                                          Por tanto, la
                                                          posibilidad de
                                                          que *quizá*
                                                          *alguna gente*
                                                          *pueda*
                                                          sentirse
                                                          frustrada por
                                                          una consulta a
                                                          la asamblea
                                                          general no me
                                                          parece
                                                          argumento
                                                          suficiente.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Dicho esto,
                                                          ¿es necesario
                                                          quedar para
                                                          que Dani
                                                          *intente*
                                                          desbaratarnos
                                                          los planes o,
                                                          mejor aún,
                                                          para que nos
                                                          ofrezca
                                                          razones
                                                          técnicas y
                                                          políticas a
                                                          partir de las
                                                          cuales buscar
                                                          una solución
                                                          consensuada?<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Salud y besos.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          El 25/10/2010
                                                          12:26, Angela
                                                          Alvarez
                                                          escribió:
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <blockquote type="cite">
                                                          <div>Hola,</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>aunque
                                                          queramos
                                                          ignorar a
                                                          Pitufo gruñón
                                                          el caso es que
                                                          ha hablado...
                                                          y qué,
                                                          ¿seguimos
                                                          adelante con
                                                          las decisiones
                                                          que tomamos el
                                                          viernes? nos
                                                          reunimos &quot;de
                                                          urgencia&quot; para
                                                          seguir
                                                          reflexionando?</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>Dani, el
                                                          tema es muy
                                                          sencillo, hay
                                                          dos grupos que
                                                          han bajado una
                                                          bolsa y hemos
                                                          pasado de 102
                                                          a 100; eso
                                                          significa que
                                                          como las
                                                          cuotas están
                                                          calculadas
                                                          para 102 pues
                                                          estamos
                                                          recogiendo
                                                          menos dinero
                                                          del
                                                          presupuestado
                                                          y necesario.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>a) En el
                                                          corto plazo:
                                                          No s epuede
                                                          sostener la
                                                          situación
                                                          indefinidamente
                                                          así, sin tomar
                                                          medidas,
                                                          porque el
                                                          agujero crece.
                                                          Así que
                                                          alguien tiene
                                                          que decidir
                                                          como se
                                                          compensa este
                                                          dinero;
                                                          teniendo en
                                                          cuenta que los
                                                          grupos
                                                          expusieron
                                                          varias veces
                                                          en las
                                                          asambleas su
                                                          decisión y
                                                          nadie les dijo
                                                          que no, creo
                                                          que no
                                                          podemos devolverle
                                                          el problema a
                                                          los grupos por
                                                          cuenta y
                                                          riesgo del
                                                          Comecón sin
                                                          consultar con
                                                          nadie.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>b) En el
                                                          medio plazo:
                                                          Si existe (que
                                                          no lo sabemos)
                                                          un acuerdo
                                                          sobre que los
                                                          grupos no
                                                          pueden bajarse
                                                          las bolsas sin
                                                          que las asuma
                                                          otro, hay que
                                                          recordarlo y
                                                          ratificarlo,
                                                          puesto que
                                                          nadie pueso
                                                          esta objeción
                                                          en las
                                                          asambleas
                                                          correspondientes.
                                                          En caso de no
                                                          ratificarse
                                                          establecer
                                                          alguna fórmula
                                                          para estas
                                                          situaciones.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>El otro
                                                          tema que
                                                          queríamos
                                                          consultar es
                                                          lo de la pasta
                                                          de AC
                                                          colectivas de
                                                          2009, que creo
                                                          que no es nada
                                                          grabe y se
                                                          trata
                                                          simplemente de
                                                          controlar que
                                                          los datos que
                                                          estamos
                                                          manejando son
                                                          ok; pero si se
                                                          plantea bien y
                                                          tranqui nadie
                                                          tiene porqué
                                                          ponerse
                                                          nervioso por
                                                          eso.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>Saludos!
                                                          freakonomics<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div class="gmail_quote">El
                                                          22 de octubre
                                                          de 2010 21:07,
                                                          dani <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:dani.berzas@gmail.com" target="_blank">dani.berzas@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span>
                                                          escribió:<br>
                                                          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="padding-left: 1ex; margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);">Hola,<br>
                                                          he estado
                                                          chateando con
                                                          Liber y me ha
                                                          dejado un poco
                                                          preocupado
                                                          porque dice
                                                          que váis a
                                                          preguntar no
                                                          se qué a los
                                                          grupos.<br>
                                                          No conozco
                                                          exactamente la
                                                          consulta pero
                                                          me preocupa.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          &quot;Acabamos&quot; de
                                                          tener un
                                                          plenario
                                                          económico que
                                                          ha dejado las
                                                          cosas más o
                                                          menos atadas
                                                          hasta 2013, si
                                                          no recuerdo
                                                          mal.<br>
                                                          Creo que una
                                                          consulta muy
                                                          técnica a los
                                                          grupos ahora
                                                          produciría:<br>
                                                          1) sensación
                                                          de que el BAH,
                                                          y sus cuentas,
                                                          son algo muy
                                                          complicado.
                                                          Eso resulta
                                                          algo
                                                          frustrante.<br>
                                                          2) sensación
                                                          de que el
                                                          plenario no se
                                                          cerró el tema
                                                          del todo. Eso
                                                          resulta algo
                                                          frustrante.<br>
                                                          3) puede abrir
                                                          temas de
                                                          debate
                                                          económico en
                                                          este momento,
                                                          en el que hay
                                                          gente
                                                          intentando
                                                          cambiar la
                                                          agenda hacia
                                                          temas más
                                                          políticos. <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Yo intentaría
                                                          tomar la
                                                          decisión entre
                                                          nosotros,
                                                          pensando más
                                                          en el bien del
                                                          BAH que en que
                                                          cuadren los
                                                          números. Creo
                                                          que todavía
                                                          tenemos margen
                                                          de maniobra
                                                          económica para
                                                          ser flexibles
                                                          en algunas
                                                          cosas. (No sé
                                                          por qué lo
                                                          creo, si no sé
                                                          como están las
                                                          cuentas).<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Así que me
                                                          gustaría que
                                                          andáis
                                                          tramando para
                                                          desbarataros
                                                          los planes...
                                                          jia jia jia.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Besos a todas.<br>
                                                          Ya solo me
                                                          queda escribir
                                                          un libro.<br clear="all">
                                                          <font color="#888888"><br>
                                                          -- <br>
                                                          _)_/\_|\|_|_<br>
                                                          </font><br>
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