an update on fon open wife
Michiel de Jong <[email protected]> Jul 05 10:13PM +0200 ^<?ui=2&view=bsp&ver=ohhl4rw8mbn4#130fcf50df13f45f_digest_top> this has some info http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,15194360,00.html and this is relevant to the topic: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/04/open-wireless-movement so there are two problems with open wifi: - the wifi protocol does not have a safe way of being open. it is either encrypted and closed, or open and unencrypted. This means that open wifi routers suffer from poor security for all protocols except ones that are themselves secure, like vpn, ssh and https. - it is (at least in some countries) illegal to give connectivity to strangers, or at least, it makes you partly responsible for the behaviour of those strangers. this is absurd - it is like if you allow people to walk over your land, and a bank robber uses that path to get away, you become responsible for helping that bank robber get away over your land. Afaik such rules do not apply to when you allow people to use a path over your land, but it apparently does apply if you allow people a path over your router. Anyway, what i understand is that since Fon is a closed club of people (only Fon owners can use other Fon access points), it's like those cigar bars that evade the non-smoking policy because they are a 'members club' instead of a bar. Instead of blocking these efforts, governments should take an example from Estonia, a country that understood that universal wifi is a good thing for a civilized country - something like universal education, health care etcetera. http://news.cnet.com/Estonia-sets-shining-Wi-Fi-example/2010-7351_3-5924673.... HTH Michiel -- P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss: http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation Updates: http://del.icio.us/mbauwens; http://friendfeed.com/mbauwens; http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens
Hi Michel, I love the typo in the subject line... Much merriment if one carries forward a similar change through the text :) M -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Michel Bauwens Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2011 1:37 AM To: p2p-foundation Subject: [P2P-F] an update on fon open wife Michiel de Jong <[email protected]> Jul 05 10:13PM +0200 ^ this has some info http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,15194360,00.html and this is relevant to the topic: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/04/open-wireless-movement so there are two problems with open wife: - the wife protocol does not have a safe way of being open. it is either encrypted and closed, or open and unencrypted. This means that open wife routers suffer from poor security for all protocols except ones that are themselves secure, like vpn, ssh and https. - it is (at least in some countries) illegal to give connectivity to strangers, or at least, it makes you partly responsible for the behaviour of those strangers. this is absurd - it is like if you allow people to walk over your land, and a bank robber uses that path to get away, you become responsible for helping that bank robber get away over your land. Afaik such rules do not apply to when you allow people to use a path over your land, but it apparently does apply if you allow people a path over your router. Anyway, what i understand is that since Fon is a closed club of people (only Fon owners can use other Fon access points), it's like those cigar bars that evade the non-smoking policy because they are a 'members club' instead of a bar. Instead of blocking these efforts, governments should take an example from Estonia, a country that understood that universal wife is a good thing for a civilized country - something like universal education, health care etcetera. http://news.cnet.com/Estonia-sets-shining-Wi-Fi-example/2010-7351_3-5924673. html HTH Michiel -- P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss: http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation Updates: http://del.icio.us/mbauwens; http://friendfeed.com/mbauwens; http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens
oh my ... what's on a man's mind <g> On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 8:53 PM, michael gurstein <[email protected]>wrote:
** Hi Michel,
I love the typo in the subject line...
Much merriment if one carries forward a similar change through the text :)
M
-----Original Message-----******
From: [email protected] [mailto: [email protected]] On Behalf Of Michel Bauwens** **
Sent: ****Wednesday, July 20, 2011** **1:37 AM******
To: p2p-foundation****
Subject: [P2P-F] an update on fon open wife****
** **
** **
Michiel de Jong <[email protected]> Jul **05 10:13PM** +0200 ^****
****
this has some info http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,15194360,00.html** **
****
and this is relevant to the topic:****
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/04/open-wireless-movement****
****
so there are two problems with open wife:****
- the wife protocol does not have a safe way of being open. it is either** **
encrypted and closed, or open and unencrypted. This means that open wife** **
routers suffer from poor security for all protocols except ones that are** **
themselves secure, like vpn, ssh and https.****
- it is (at least in some countries) illegal to give connectivity to****
strangers, or at least, it makes you partly responsible for the behaviour of****
those strangers. this is absurd - it is like if you allow people to walk** **
over your land, and a bank robber uses that path to get away, you become** **
responsible for helping that bank robber get away over your land. Afaik such****
rules do not apply to when you allow people to use a path over your land,* ***
but it apparently does apply if you allow people a path over your router.* ***
****
Anyway, what i understand is that since Fon is a closed club of people (only****
Fon owners can use other Fon access points), it's like those cigar bars that****
evade the non-smoking policy because they are a 'members club' instead of a ****
bar.****
****
Instead of blocking these efforts, governments should take an example from ****
****Estonia****, a country that understood that universal wife is a good thing for a****
civilized country - something like universal education, health care****
etcetera.****
http://news.cnet.com/Estonia-sets-shining-Wi-Fi-example/2010-7351_3-5924673.... ****
****
HTH****
Michiel -- P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net
Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss: http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation
Updates: http://del.icio.us/mbauwens; http://friendfeed.com/mbauwens; http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens
_______________________________________________ P2P Foundation - Mailing list http://www.p2pfoundation.net https://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation
-- P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net Connect: http://p2pfoundation.ning.com; Discuss: http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation Updates: http://del.icio.us/mbauwens; http://friendfeed.com/mbauwens; http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens
On Wed, Jul 20, 2011 at 8:53 AM, michael gurstein <[email protected]> wrote:
I love the typo in the subject line...
Much merriment if one carries forward a similar change through the text :)
Yeah, my immediate thought was "Wow, they're really into all kinds of sharing now." -- Kevin Carson Center for a Stateless Society http://c4ss.org Mutualist Blog: Free Market Anti-Capitalism http://mutualist.blogspot.com The Homebrew Industrial Revolution: A Low-Overhead Manifesto http://homebrewindustrialrevolution.wordpress.com Organization Theory: A Libertarian Perspective http://mutualist.blogspot.com/2005/12/studies-in-anarchist-theory-of.html
participants (3)
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Kevin Carson -
michael gurstein -
Michel Bauwens