Micro and nano-tribunes and power generators
The title got me think of real micro- or nano-turbine technologies being developed to produce electricity. For instance, if used inside water pipes and ways, such technology would turn entire city and rural delivery and sanitation systems more productive at the micro and nano levels then huge dams and other smaller central hydro electricity generators. Something like this could complete the convergence between energy and communication technologies as in Rifkin's theory, at the same physical level. While thinking on this remembered once seeing a working nano-engine being used at an experiment at CERN at the atomic level. Of course if engine do exist then tribune should also be so. Googled "nano tribune electricity" and found that it does exist, and developed: http://www.nanowerk.com/news2/green/newsid=27983.php http://www.homepower.ca/dc_hydro.htm In case collectively opened up, peer to peer produced, and implemented, these really micro power technologies would not only destroy the state and corporate monopoly over the energy production, but also Harvey's pessimistic argument about we people's being dependent on central structures for the creation and maintenance of large infrastructures and services, as dams, roads, hospitals and schools. If Sensorica, or any open science groups would go towards this direction, it would obviously more impactful than it sounds. Best, Orsan Sent from my iPad
On 8 jan. 2016, at 23:23, Roberto Verzola <[email protected]> wrote:
I just finished the piece "Can micropower be as deep a game-changer as microprocessing?" It can be downloaded at:
https://rverzola.wordpress.com/2016/01/07/can-micropower-become-as-deep-a-ga...
By "deep", I mean being able to change the rules of the game not only within the industry itself but in society as a whole. In the piece, I note that the declining prices of renewables such as solar and wind seem to have brought the renewables sector at the same take-off point that microprocessing was some three decades ago.
I analyze the developments from the perspective I've been pursuing, which is the perspective of abundance. I note that these declining prices, exponential increases in production, and expanding markets are bringing these renewables into operating points where the economics of increasing returns to scale start to take-over, leading to a virtuous cycle of more rounds of price declines and higher production, the same kind of economic growth pattern we have seen in the information sector. These are typical features of the onset of abundance.
I discuss in the piece what might be the conditions that can make small-scale generation with renewables as deep a game-changer as microprocessors have been.
Greetings to all,
Roberto Verzola Philippines
PS. Those who want more details about developments in renewables from the perspective of a developing country, you can also download my recent book, CROSSING OVER: THE ENERGY TRANSITION TO RENEWABLE ELECTRICITY. Just google the title.
On Thu, 7 Jan 2016 19:03:57 +0700 Michel Bauwens <[email protected]> wrote:
see http://excellencereporter.com/2016/01/07/michel-bauwens-the-meaning-that-we-...
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Brilliant Orsan, every time we flush the loo, or clean our teeth, we produce electricity! On Jan 9, 2016 1:48 AM, "Orsan" <[email protected]> wrote:
The title got me think of real micro- or nano-turbine technologies being developed to produce electricity. For instance, if used inside water pipes and ways, such technology would turn entire city and rural delivery and sanitation systems more productive at the micro and nano levels then huge dams and other smaller central hydro electricity generators. Something like this could complete the convergence between energy and communication technologies as in Rifkin's theory, at the same physical level. While thinking on this remembered once seeing a working nano-engine being used at an experiment at CERN at the atomic level. Of course if engine do exist then tribune should also be so. Googled "nano tribune electricity" and found that it does exist, and developed: http://www.nanowerk.com/news2/green/newsid=27983.php http://www.homepower.ca/dc_hydro.htm In case collectively opened up, peer to peer produced, and implemented, these really micro power technologies would not only destroy the state and corporate monopoly over the energy production, but also Harvey's pessimistic argument about we people's being dependent on central structures for the creation and maintenance of large infrastructures and services, as dams, roads, hospitals and schools. If Sensorica, or any open science groups would go towards this direction, it would obviously more impactful than it sounds. Best, Orsan
Sent from my iPad
On 8 jan. 2016, at 23:23, Roberto Verzola <[email protected]> wrote:
I just finished the piece "Can micropower be as deep a game-changer as microprocessing?" It can be downloaded at:
https://rverzola.wordpress.com/2016/01/07/can-micropower-become-as-deep-a-ga...
By "deep", I mean being able to change the rules of the game not only within the industry itself but in society as a whole. In the piece, I note that the declining prices of renewables such as solar and wind seem to have brought the renewables sector at the same take-off point that microprocessing was some three decades ago.
I analyze the developments from the perspective I've been pursuing, which is the perspective of abundance. I note that these declining prices, exponential increases in production, and expanding markets are bringing these renewables into operating points where the economics of increasing returns to scale start to take-over, leading to a virtuous cycle of more rounds of price declines and higher production, the same kind of economic growth pattern we have seen in the information sector. These are typical features of the onset of abundance.
I discuss in the piece what might be the conditions that can make small-scale generation with renewables as deep a game-changer as microprocessors have been.
Greetings to all,
Roberto Verzola Philippines
PS. Those who want more details about developments in renewables from the perspective of a developing country, you can also download my recent book, CROSSING OVER: THE ENERGY TRANSITION TO RENEWABLE ELECTRICITY. Just google the title.
On Thu, 7 Jan 2016 19:03:57 +0700 Michel Bauwens <[email protected]> wrote:
see
http://excellencereporter.com/2016/01/07/michel-bauwens-the-meaning-that-we-...
_______________________________________________ P2P Foundation - Mailing list
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making a donation. Thank you for your support.
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every time we flush the loo, or clean our teeth, we produce electricity!
To brain storm a bit further -as a practice of open tech: A tribune is reverse engineered engine that passes the kinetic energy of any moving objects (like water or air molecules) to a magnet that then moves within a magnetic field created by cooper wires rolled around. Moving magnet in such a filed generate a flow of electrons on the copper wire which we call electricity; these electrons can be collected and stored (condensed) to be used later. In practice nano engines are being implemented in smartphone or any other micro processor cooling systems. So turbines at the size of such nano engines (we all have in our smartphones) are existing developed technology too. Such tribunes could be used to transform smallest level kinetic energy exist into electricity, and store it for later use. So in a sense wherever there is a constant motion there is waste of unharvested clean energy; be it a hydraulic flows (of rivers, water pipes, loos), or vibrating threes cars and trains, sea waves, walking people, photonics stream of light (of the sun), or flowing air molecules as in case of wind. To transform radiation or thermal force, or other forms of energy first to kinetic energy (motion) then produce energy is more work and waste (of energy). Orsan
On Saturday, January 09, 2016 07:53:12 AM Anna Harris wrote:
Brilliant Orsan, every time we flush the loo, or clean our teeth, we produce electricity!
On Jan 9, 2016 1:48 AM, "Orsan" <[email protected]> wrote:
The title got me think of real micro- or nano-turbine technologies being developed to produce electricity. For instance, if used inside water pipes and ways, such technology would turn entire city and rural delivery and sanitation systems more productive at the micro and nano levels then huge dams and other smaller central hydro electricity generators.
If we were really doing efficient home and community design you probably wouldn't be flushing toilets. Solutions like composting toilets require no centralized sewage infrastructure. Centralized distribution of water can also be problematic as seen currently in Flint [1]. In permaculture, isn't getting water to where it needs to be done using the entire landscape rather than a narrow network of pipes or canals? Sustainable and distributed infrastructure must tend towards simplicity and openness. This means operating with fewer components that have fewer dependencies so that local customization can easily be done. Adding an extra layer of complexity (wires, batteries, and magnets) on top of an existing poorly performing system (sewer and water) seems like a step in the wrong direction. On Sat, Jan 9, 2016 at 5:23 AM, Roberto Verzola <[email protected]> wrote:
I just finished the piece "Can micropower be as deep a game-changer as microprocessing?" It can be downloaded at:
https://rverzola.wordpress.com/2016/01/07/can-micropower-become-as-deep-a-ga...
By "deep", I mean being able to change the rules of the game not only within the industry itself but in society as a whole. In the piece, I note that the declining prices of renewables such as solar and wind seem to have brought the renewables sector at the same take-off point that microprocessing was some three decades ago.
The microprocessors we buy are nice but the process that makes them are still controlled by a small number of corporations. Restated, individuals can use these "micro" things to their advantage, but at the cost of being utterly dependent on a global system of capitalist production over which they have no control. It's the social relations of production that need to "deeply" change, and no fancy gadget is going to do that for you. -Karl [1] http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/oct/04/flint-michigan-lead-water-chi...
In fact you don't have to go nano or wait for other esoteric and untested technologies for renewable technologies to undermine the current energy paradigms. Rooftop solar is now spreading rapidly due to the continuing declines in solar panel prices, enabling households to generate their own electricity. This creates a situation where they will be sending their surplus to the grid some of the time, and getting their additional supply from the grid at some other times. Thus, they will be engaging in peering arrangements with the grid itself, which are actually P2P transactions. At some point when P2P transactions over the grid exceed the amount that central power plants provide to non-generating customers, the grid will start taking on more and more the nature of a public commons. Then we should see the same kinds of debates between privatized infrastructures and the commons that have arisen elsewhere. I also discussed in the paper how microhydro and microwind, by getting smaller instead of larger, and if this can result in one or a few orders of magnitude price reductions, as happened with integrated circuits, can put them in production levels where the economics of increasing returns to scale is activated. By the way, I've written a separate paper analyzing the P2P transactions between the grid and solar owners under net metering. Those who are interested may google "pseudo-net-metering double-charges customers". This may be very relevant to countries where net metering is implemented and where utilities insist on charging lower than retail price, which results in double-charging. I use very simple math in the paper to show exactly where the double-charging happens. Requiring net metering is such an important policy enabler for microsolar, that utilities are now campaigning very hard against it. A lot of exciting things, such as battery storage costs starting on a downhill trend, are happening in the renewables area. I urge people to look more closely into this sector, if you haven't yet. Some of these are discussed in my book Crossing Over: The Energy Transition to Renewable Electricity, published last year but also freely available online (just google the title). The sector will also need in the near future new paradigms and business models to properly appropriate the new values created by the new types of P2P energy exchanges that are emerging. Greetings to all, Roberto Greetings to all, Roberto On Sat, 9 Jan 2016 02:47:24 +0100 Orsan <[email protected]> wrote:
The title got me think of real micro- or nano-turbine technologies being developed to produce electricity. For instance, if used inside water pipes and ways, such technology would turn entire city and rural delivery and sanitation systems more productive at the micro and nano levels then huge dams and other smaller central hydro electricity generators. Something like this could complete the convergence between energy and communication technologies as in Rifkin's theory, at the same physical level. While thinking on this remembered once seeing a working nano-engine being used at an experiment at CERN at the atomic level. Of course if engine do exist then tribune should also be so. Googled "nano tribune electricity" and found that it does exist, and developed: http://www.nanowerk.com/news2/green/newsid=27983.php http://www.homepower.ca/dc_hydro.htm In case collectively opened up, peer to peer produced, and implemented, these really micro power technologies would not only destroy the state and corporate monopoly over the energy production, but also Harvey's pessimistic argument about we people's being dependent on central structures for the creation and maintenance of large infrastructures and services, as dams, roads, hospitals and schools. If Sensorica, or any open science groups would go towards this direction, it would obviously more impactful than it sounds. Best, Orsan
Sent from my iPad
On 8 jan. 2016, at 23:23, Roberto Verzola <[email protected]> wrote:
I just finished the piece "Can micropower be as deep a game-changer as microprocessing?" It can be downloaded at:
https://rverzola.wordpress.com/2016/01/07/can-micropower-become-as-deep-a-ga...
By "deep", I mean being able to change the rules of the game not only within the industry itself but in society as a whole. In the piece, I note that the declining prices of renewables such as solar and wind seem to have brought the renewables sector at the same take-off point that microprocessing was some three decades ago.
I analyze the developments from the perspective I've been pursuing, which is the perspective of abundance. I note that these declining prices, exponential increases in production, and expanding markets are bringing these renewables into operating points where the economics of increasing returns to scale start to take-over, leading to a virtuous cycle of more rounds of price declines and higher production, the same kind of economic growth pattern we have seen in the information sector. These are typical features of the onset of abundance.
I discuss in the piece what might be the conditions that can make small-scale generation with renewables as deep a game-changer as microprocessors have been.
Greetings to all,
Roberto Verzola Philippines
PS. Those who want more details about developments in renewables from the perspective of a developing country, you can also download my recent book, CROSSING OVER: THE ENERGY TRANSITION TO RENEWABLE ELECTRICITY. Just google the title.
On Thu, 7 Jan 2016 19:03:57 +0700 Michel Bauwens <[email protected]> wrote:
see http://excellencereporter.com/2016/01/07/michel-bauwens-the-meaning-that-we-...
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In fact you don't have to go nano or wait for other esoteric and untested technologies for renewable technologies to undermine the current energy paradigms.
I do agree, and also thanks for your paper.
Rooftop solar is now spreading rapidly due to the continuing declines in solar panel prices, enabling households to generate their own electricity. This creates a situation where they will be sending their surplus to the grid some of the time, and getting their additional supply from the grid at some other times. Thus, they will be engaging in peering arrangements with the grid itself, which are actually P2P transactions. At some point when P2P transactions over the grid exceed the amount that central power plants provide to non-generating customers, the grid will start taking on more and more the nature of a public commons. Then we should see the same kinds of debates between privatized infrastructures and the commons that have arisen elsewhere.
Thinking of what happened to Internet, the Grid which is designed, built and governed by more and more centralizing and authoritarian state-corporate partnerships does not seem too promising from outside, but I need to read more about it.
I also discussed in the paper how microhydro and microwind, by getting smaller instead of larger, and if this can result in one or a few orders of magnitude price reductions, as happened with integrated circuits, can put them in production levels where the economics of increasing returns to scale is activated.
Indeed you do mention and evaluate existing technologies (known to you?) realistically.
By the way, I've written a separate paper analyzing the P2P transactions between the grid and solar owners under net metering. Those who are interested may google "pseudo-net-metering double-charges customers". This may be very relevant to countries where net metering is implemented and where utilities insist on charging lower than retail price, which results in double-charging. I use very simple math in the paper to show exactly where the double-charging happens.
Personally I am interested and will look into that paper too.
Requiring net metering is such an important policy enabler for microsolar, that utilities are now campaigning very hard against it.
A lot of exciting things, such as battery storage costs starting on a downhill trend, are happening in the renewables area. I urge people to look more closely into this sector, if you haven't yet.
Some of these are discussed in my book Crossing Over: The Energy Transition to Renewable Electricity, published last year but also freely available online (just google the title).
The sector will also need in the near future new paradigms and business models to properly appropriate the new values created by the new types of P2P energy exchanges that are emerging.
Would you know or be able to say anything about the wireless electricity distribution technology? would it make any bigger impact then charging batteries with but sharing power within communities? Best, Orsan
dear Roberto, we would be happy to serialize your findings if you have time to select parts of your book, Michel On Sat, Jan 9, 2016 at 9:56 PM, Roberto Verzola <[email protected]> wrote:
In fact you don't have to go nano or wait for other esoteric and untested technologies for renewable technologies to undermine the current energy paradigms.
Rooftop solar is now spreading rapidly due to the continuing declines in solar panel prices, enabling households to generate their own electricity. This creates a situation where they will be sending their surplus to the grid some of the time, and getting their additional supply from the grid at some other times. Thus, they will be engaging in peering arrangements with the grid itself, which are actually P2P transactions. At some point when P2P transactions over the grid exceed the amount that central power plants provide to non-generating customers, the grid will start taking on more and more the nature of a public commons. Then we should see the same kinds of debates between privatized infrastructures and the commons that have arisen elsewhere.
I also discussed in the paper how microhydro and microwind, by getting smaller instead of larger, and if this can result in one or a few orders of magnitude price reductions, as happened with integrated circuits, can put them in production levels where the economics of increasing returns to scale is activated.
By the way, I've written a separate paper analyzing the P2P transactions between the grid and solar owners under net metering. Those who are interested may google "pseudo-net-metering double-charges customers". This may be very relevant to countries where net metering is implemented and where utilities insist on charging lower than retail price, which results in double-charging. I use very simple math in the paper to show exactly where the double-charging happens.
Requiring net metering is such an important policy enabler for microsolar, that utilities are now campaigning very hard against it.
A lot of exciting things, such as battery storage costs starting on a downhill trend, are happening in the renewables area. I urge people to look more closely into this sector, if you haven't yet.
Some of these are discussed in my book Crossing Over: The Energy Transition to Renewable Electricity, published last year but also freely available online (just google the title).
The sector will also need in the near future new paradigms and business models to properly appropriate the new values created by the new types of P2P energy exchanges that are emerging.
Greetings to all,
Roberto
Greetings to all,
Roberto
On Sat, 9 Jan 2016 02:47:24 +0100 Orsan <[email protected]> wrote:
The title got me think of real micro- or nano-turbine technologies being developed to produce electricity. For instance, if used inside water pipes and ways, such technology would turn entire city and rural delivery and sanitation systems more productive at the micro and nano levels then huge dams and other smaller central hydro electricity generators. Something like this could complete the convergence between energy and communication technologies as in Rifkin's theory, at the same physical level. While thinking on this remembered once seeing a working nano-engine being used at an experiment at CERN at the atomic level. Of course if engine do exist then tribune should also be so. Googled "nano tribune electricity" and found that it does exist, and developed: http://www.nanowerk.com/news2/green/newsid=27983.php http://www.homepower.ca/dc_hydro.htm In case collectively opened up, peer to peer produced, and implemented, these really micro power technologies would not only destroy the state and corporate monopoly over the energy production, but also Harvey's pessimistic argument about we people's being dependent on central structures for the creation and maintenance of large infrastructures and services, as dams, roads, hospitals and schools. If Sensorica, or any open science groups would go towards this direction, it would obviously more impactful than it sounds. Best, Orsan
Sent from my iPad
On 8 jan. 2016, at 23:23, Roberto Verzola <[email protected]> wrote:
I just finished the piece "Can micropower be as deep a game-changer as microprocessing?" It can be downloaded at:
https://rverzola.wordpress.com/2016/01/07/can-micropower-become-as-deep-a-ga...
By "deep", I mean being able to change the rules of the game not only within the industry itself but in society as a whole. In the piece, I note that the declining prices of renewables such as solar and wind seem to have brought the renewables sector at the same take-off point that microprocessing was some three decades ago.
I analyze the developments from the perspective I've been pursuing, which is the perspective of abundance. I note that these declining prices, exponential increases in production, and expanding markets are bringing these renewables into operating points where the economics of increasing returns to scale start to take-over, leading to a virtuous cycle of more rounds of price declines and higher production, the same kind of economic growth pattern we have seen in the information sector. These are typical features of the onset of abundance.
I discuss in the piece what might be the conditions that can make small-scale generation with renewables as deep a game-changer as microprocessors have been.
Greetings to all,
Roberto Verzola Philippines
PS. Those who want more details about developments in renewables from the perspective of a developing country, you can also download my recent book, CROSSING OVER: THE ENERGY TRANSITION TO RENEWABLE ELECTRICITY. Just google the title.
On Thu, 7 Jan 2016 19:03:57 +0700 Michel Bauwens <[email protected]> wrote:
see
http://excellencereporter.com/2016/01/07/michel-bauwens-the-meaning-that-we-...
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participants (6)
-
Anna Harris -
Karl Robillard -
Michel Bauwens -
Orsan -
Orsan Senalp
-
Roberto Verzola