dear David,.

I would see a rather big difference between the locally-based intentional communities based on intense and local community-based collectivism, and the peer production phyles that are based on open contributions. They are both legitimate, but they are very different beasts. I wonder if it's a good idea to have them both at the same table from the very beginning.

PErsonally, I don't think so, because their orientation and goals are so different. They predate the network age, and often have no intention to project systemic power at the global level, which is my aim in this gathering of proto-phyles, i.e. the gathering of transnational ethical entrepreneurial coalitions, based on commons and peer production.

Any encounter between them and localized intentional communities I would see as a eventual later step,

furthermore, my availability during the period march 15 to june 15 will be severely constrained by the ambitious project in Ghent,

Michel

Michel

On Fri, Nov 25, 2016 at 6:30 PM, David de Ugarte <david@lasindias.coop> wrote:

So great!!

I would invite to this proto-phyle meeting the egalitarian communities already in motion (the FEC in USA, Kommuja in Germany, Longo Mai in the Alps) and some interesting small communities world wide (Kibutz Samar, Kibutz Lotan, Le Manoir, etc.). There are interesting approaches between all of them and some of them, as The FEC, already have internal mutual systems between their communities.

Do some of you want to lead such a meeting?

If the answer is yes we will love to help, if it is no, I could ask my fellow indianos and look for a date during... ¿springtime?

Big hug!

David


On 2016-11-25 10:51, Michel Bauwens wrote:
dear David and friends,

I will be working next spring on a commons transition project for the city of Ghent, (under embargo, official announcement on dec 2 only), 

one of my first priorities there, will be the development of city-based programs to relocate production and to create incomes, work and employment not just for the precarious knowledge workers but especially for blue-collar communities,

see here an article more or less expressing the same thought:


Eventually, after my relocation in brussels in the fall, to work 100 days a year for the fast-growing labour mutual Smart (now a european cooperative structure with 75k members and growing), I also want to create a Commons Transition based think thank in the heart of Europe,

I am still hoping that the groups and individuals addressed in the earlier request, would be willing to organize some inter-phyles congress at some point, and I'd be very happy to help with that,

Michel

On Tue, Nov 15, 2016 at 1:34 AM, David de Ugarte <david@lasindias.coop> wrote:

And coming back to our subject... what do you propose to do?


On 2016-11-03 15:10, Michel Bauwens wrote:
but actually, many former members say exactly that, that the Impact Hub is extractive.

The general complaint is that the venture-based ownership model is generating too much pressure on what should be a collaborative and participative model ..

Personally, I have witnessed the forced smiles of many of hostesses (often the hubs are led by female members and employees), who are under great pressure to 'perform' their participative duties (number of events organized, number of new clients recruited, etc ..); and heard from outsiders, that an enormous amount of skills are required for relatively low pay,

I haven't verified any of this, but this is based on testimonies,

Michel



On Sun, Oct 23, 2016 at 6:35 PM, David de Ugarte <david@lasindias.coop> wrote:
I did not mean they were extractive, they are just a network of coworking spaces, what I pointed is the difference of this kind of transnational network and phyles: having a common identity alternative to that of nationalism and taking care of there members in case of necessity. Impacthub does not provide other identity different to the one that provides you to be client of a nice transnational landlord nor takes care of you more than any firm takes care of a client.



On 2016-10-23 13:29, Bob Haugen wrote:
I'm not familiar with ImpactHub (just looked at their website a bit,
though). In what way are they extractive?

On Sun, Oct 23, 2016 at 2:47 AM, Michel Bauwens
<michel@p2pfoundation.net> wrote:

On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 10:13 PM, David de Ugarte <david@lasindias.coop>
wrote:

but essentiallly for me a phyle is a trans-national business eco-system
for a community and its commons


I agree, but could have sense to be more specific in order to separate it
from pure transnational ecosystems as ImpactHub including something about
identity or responsability on the welfare of the individual partners? What
do you think?

Yes, I agree that is a part of the definition, to distinguish it from the
extractive models, which I think the ImpactHub actually is, despite its
original good intentions ..

by the way, all assistance in mapping the new global nomadic networks would
be very welcome:

https://wiki.p2pfoundation.net/Category:Nomadic_Infrastructures

Michel




for me las indias, enspiral, sensorica, ethos VO go in that direction ...


Great!

Big hug
David




On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 7:11 PM, David de Ugarte <david@lasindias.coop>
wrote:
Great Michael!

So... it could be interesting to have a common, and a little bit
detailed, definition of phyle understanding proto-phyle as all the nucleus
going in that direction.

Would you make the honours? :-D


On 2016-10-18 14:03, Michel Bauwens wrote:

personally, I am talking about some coordination and cooperation between
proto-phyles ...

coordinating commons-based production is a different topic, equally
interesting but this was not the topic of the original invite,

of course, phyles could <also> coordinate their production, if they were
more fully developed etc ..

Michel

On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 6:58 PM, David de Ugarte <david@lasindias.coop>
wrote:
Ah! OK, this is about coordinating commons based projects, not about
phyle making. So, the question should be then how phyle nucleus as ours, can
contribute to these movement towards territorial coordination of commons
based projects, Am I right?

We agree with that idea/project and we will give our best to it, no
doubt. But, please lets use the word phyle with its meaning. From its very
origins the phyle idea had a very concrete goal: to create an alternative to
national identity able to complement the fading (¿collapsing?) welfare state
and take responsibility for its own members (social security, health,
guarantee of job and trade inside, safety and freedom of movements, etc.)
what made mandatory to the few phyle nucleus existing then, to have a
presence and a real autonomy in the open market while constructing a
money-free economy in its interior.



On 2016-10-18 12:58, David de Ugarte wrote:

Great thanks to you both!!!


On 2016-10-18 12:57, Stacco Troncoso wrote:

Here's the Commons Association text in our blog, if you don't like PDFs
;)


https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/unifying-commons-based-projects-in-a-self-organised-solidarity-economy/2016/09/09

On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 12:53 PM, Bob Haugen <bob.haugen@gmail.com>
wrote:
You all might find the pdfs below to be relevant:



---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Christian Siefkes via Commonsverbuende
<commonsverbuende@lists.commons-institut.org>
Date: 2016-10-18 5:06 GMT-05:00
Subject: Re: [commonsverbuende] Commons Associations jetzt auch in
Englisch
To: commonsverbuende@lists.commons-institut.org


Hallo Hannes und alle,

On 08/10/16 15:41, Christian Siefkes via Commonsverbuende wrote:
OK, ich werde PDFs erzeugen und hochladen und dann hier nochmal
Bescheid sagen.
ich habe die PDfs jetzt erstellt und bei Keimform hochgeladen. Sie sind
vom
deutsch- bzw. englischsprachigen Artikel aus verlinkt oder direkt unter
folgenden URLs zu finden:

Deutsch:
http://keimform.de/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/commonsverbund.pdf
Englisch:
http://keimform.de/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/commons-association.pdf

Herzliche Grüße
         Christian

--
|--------- Dr. Christian Siefkes --------- christian@siefkes.net
---------
| Homepage:   http://www.siefkes.net/   |   Blog:
http://www.keimform.de/
| Wie Produktion zur Nebensache wurde:
www.keimform.de/2013/freie-quellen-1/
| Why Production No Longer Worries Us:
www.keimform.de/2013/free-sources-1/
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On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 5:19 AM, Bob Haugen <bob.haugen@gmail.com>
wrote:
Responses inline.

On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 5:06 AM, David de Ugarte
<david@lasindias.coop> wrote:
Dear Bob,

it is a really interesting theoretical approach but... I guess we
are still
far from the point when we could attend basic consumption demands.
The real
existing fabric of p2p production is unproportionally based in
services (as
it is natural because p2p production was born in the digital
economy).
I am aware it's mostly services now, except for food, which could be
a
place to start on material goods, at least in regional networks.

Software, however, is the heart of p2p production now, and that is
not
coordinated very well between groups or often not even within groups.
The Mutual Aid Networks, for example, use several apps that do not
talk to each other. And several Mutual Aid Networks are starting up,
that will multiply the same problem. Same for Fair Coop.

Designs for material goods is another possibility.

Increasing diversity of production is today a trend and a goal, but
I guess
diversity is not still big enough even for supporting a viable
productive
coin.

Because of it, from the very beggining we envisioned mutualism as
the path
of making phyles grow inside a wider vision we call post-laborism.
Please
have a look to this post (you will probably have to use google
translate)

https://lasindias.com/post-laborismo
Thanks, will study.

On 2016-10-16 11:56, Bob Haugen wrote:
Sorry, cutnpaste error. Should have been section entitled "How we
can
implement a Mutual Coordination Economy based on existing
organizations".

On Sun, Oct 16, 2016 at 3:04 AM, Bob Haugen <bob.haugen@gmail.com>
wrote:
then see from there if it makes sense to have some extra layer of
alignment between 'proto-phyles'
Could this be it?


https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/how-the-signals-used-by-capitalist-supply-chains-could-serve-a-mutual-coordination-economy/2016/02/10

See the section entitled


"https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/how-the-signals-used-by-capitalist-supply-chains-could-serve-a-mutual-coordination-economy/2016/02/10"
and my comment below:


https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/how-the-signals-used-by-capitalist-supply-chains-could-serve-a-mutual-coordination-economy/2016/02/10#comment-1551200


On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 9:22 PM, Michel Bauwens
<michel@p2pfoundation.net> wrote:
dear David,

I have great difficulties lately to monitor my emails, 5755 to go
<g>,
and
so I missed this important response, and the ones following which
I will
process in a moment.

The first thing for me, is perhaps that we can organize a common
skype
with
joshua vial / Alanna Krause for Enspiral, Robert Pye for Ethos,
you and
Natalia for lasindias, tibi from Sensorica, perhaps others ? And
then
see
from there if it makes sense to have some extra layer of
alignment
between
'proto-phyles'

I copy Ann-Marie for the p2p foundation, for assistance in
coordinating
any
such meetup if there is agreement on doing it.

Since the previous email in this thread is an email from our
recently
deceased P2P colleague Jean Lievens, I am sharing a special
thought in
his
remembrance,

Michel

On Mon, May 23, 2016 at 6:12 PM, David de Ugarte
<david@lasindias.coop>
wrote:
We completely agree!!

It is a nodal moment because this convergence, I guess, reflects
a
deepening concern in wide social sectors. In our case, we are
experiencing
since October's Somero a widening of  our audience and a closer
relation
with other communities. Last week, in example, we had by first
time in
many
years, more than 10.000 unique visitors in our blog in only a
day, and
the
Communard Manifesto is spreading a lot faster than we thought:
there
are in
example volunteers -we did not know before- translating it in
Switzerland
and Portugal to German and Portuguese languages.

So, we are sensing not only the appearance of a «P2P theoritical
camp»,
but the emergence of a «P2P audience» probably product of the
disenchanted
with the political hopes hegemonic only a year ago between the
majority
of
the activists in countries like Spain or Greece.

So, Michel, what comes now? How could we contribute?

On 2016-05-21 22:06, Michel Bauwens wrote:

AN IMPORTANT PIVOT MOMENT TOWARDS A THE EMERGENCE OF A
COLLECTIVE
ORGANIC
INTELLECTUAL FOR THE COMMONS MOVEMENT

The above has always been the ambition of the P2P Foundation,
and I
believe this is now coalescing .. some signs

1) Las Indias has consolidated all its original insights in the
just
published Communard Manifesto (Steve Herrick: you can perhaps
let them
know
about this posting here as they are not on fb)

2) the last video by Dmytri Kleiner, which I posted here, also
shows a
convergence towards this multi-modal approach (working for the
strengthening
of the new economy within the existing one) and has a very
precise
strategy
and many innovative concepts

3) the critique by Alanna Krause on the blockchain which I
posited,
along
with the 'transvestment' practices, show that both the practice,
and
the
theory, and the subjectivity of Enspiral is moving in the same
direction

4) as for myself, I am working on a more theoretical book in
which I'm
aligning all our pasts insights following the overview of Kojin
Karatini ..

I may be forgetting some other elements, but here we are, there
is
effectively, a collective organic intellectual at work, which is
thinking
through the strategies to be followed by the forces of the
commons, in
a way
that may have been there in seed form, but is about to flower
and ..
THIS IS
HUGELY IMPORTANT

I am not implying here of course that there are no differences
between
the
approaches of these groups, but that they are moving broadly in
the
same
direction .


At present, there are not any formal bridges between these
groups, but
there are occasional informal contacts, and the memes do seem to
travel
..


With Dmytri Kleiner, we are discussing a 'Transvestment'
conference in
Berlin at the end of this year, no funding yet, this could be an
occasion
for these groups to enter into more coherent dialogue,


Michel


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Check out the Commons Transition Plan here at:
http://commonstransition.org

P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net

Updates: http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens

#82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/




--
Check out the Commons Transition Plan here at:
http://commonstransition.org

P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net

Updates: http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens

#82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/




--
Check out the Commons Transition Plan here at: http://commonstransition.org

P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net

Updates: http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens

#82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/




--




--




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Check out the Commons Transition Plan here at: http://commonstransition.org  

P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net  - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net

Updates: http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens

#82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/