Thanks Michel. We will continue the dialogue.

Best wishes, Mike.

Mike Riddell

PLUSME LIMITED 

07711 667725

From: Michel Bauwens <michel@p2pfoundation.net>
Date: Monday, 27 January 2014 21:26
To: Mike Riddell <mike@hometownplus.co.uk>
Subject: Fwd: P2P-Foundation Digest, Vol 37, Issue 48

responses on our p2p-f mailing list

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: <p2p-foundation-request@lists.ourproject.org>
Date: Mon, Jan 27, 2014 at 1:09 PM
Subject: P2P-Foundation Digest, Vol 37, Issue 48
To: p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org


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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: can anyone reach javier, our wiki tech support
      (Michel Bauwens)
   2. Fwd: Articles on FLOK in the Spanish newspapers (Michel Bauwens)
   3. Re: commons / market / currency questions by Mike Riddell
      (Karl Robillard)
   4. Email Archives (Karl Robillard)
   5. Re: commons / market / currency questions by Mike Riddell
      (Fabio Barone)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2014 07:15:06 -0500
From: Michel Bauwens <michel@p2pfoundation.net>
Subject: Re: [P2P-F] can anyone reach javier, our wiki tech support
To: p2p-foundation <p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org>,       Kevin
        Flanagan <kev.flanagan@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
        <CAK_2xiLfw7m+EDntXMSYmTNT=J3tQRN-X_5CTr6P1SrcN8eDUg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

he responded, checking the responses know, thanks Kevin

<<Message: 4
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2014 06:11:22 +0100
From: Kevin Flanagan <kev.flanagan@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [P2P-F] can anyone reach javier, our wiki tech support
To: P2P Foundation mailing list <p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org>
Message-ID:
        <CACpSwUdk3YpkewEXzgMwJLJJ9rwSBXkryiWBKU+0qa6LscDx2A@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Hi Michel unfortunately its 6 in the morning here. I can ring him at 9 if
he doesn't. respond.
On 2014-01-27 4:15 AM, "Michel Bauwens" <michel@p2pfoundation.net> wrote:

> the unannounced wiki transfer went wrong with thousands of hours of
> research material lost and this is quite distressing,
>
> can anyone reach javier, as I can't get any response in any medium ?
>

--
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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2014 07:18:08 -0500
From: Michel Bauwens <michel@p2pfoundation.net>
Subject: [P2P-F] Fwd: Articles on FLOK in the Spanish newspapers
To: p2p-foundation <p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org>,  Andr?s
        Delgado <andres@floksociety.org>, Mar?a Cristina Mart?nez Bravo
        <crism321@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
        <CAK_2xiJQxkpXvPskaAoKdX2Umz4zyZEweE6KE7Quv-VKNVqvDw@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Kevin Flanagan <kev.flanagan@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, Jan 27, 2014 at 7:14 AM
Subject: Re: Articles on FLOK in the Spanish newspapers
To: David Rozas <david.rozas@gmail.com>, Michael Bauwen <
michelsub2004@gmail.com>


Thank you very much for the Flok articles David. Speak with you soon.

Kevin


On 27 January 2014 13:03, David Rozas <david.rozas@gmail.com> wrote:

>  Hi Kevin,
>
> At the end, we managed to make it on time to the airport! ;-D
>
> Please find below some links with references to the FLOK Society in
> Spanish newspapers and social news websites:
>
>    -
>    http://www.eldiario.es/turing/Ecuador-Rafael_Correa-FLOK_Society-buen_vivir-sumak_kawsay-procomun-p2p-copyleft-patentes_0_209279080.html(Spanish newspaper).
>    - http://www.meneame.net/story/ecuador-pone-rumbo-economia-bien-comun(comments on a popular social news site).
>    - http://americas.barrapunto.com/article.pl?sid=13/12/11/2050237 (link
>    in the Spanish version of Slashdot).
>
> If I read some more, I will forward them to you.
>
> Cheers,
>
> David
>
> --
> Personal website [en|es]: http://www.davidrozas.com
> Public key: http://www.davidrozas.com/pk/drozas_pk.asc
>
>



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Message: 3
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2014 09:37:37 -0800
From: Karl Robillard <krobillard@san.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [P2P-F] commons / market / currency questions by Mike
        Riddell
To: P2P Foundation mailing list <p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org>
Message-ID: <1425530.LaPhKqGAXq@localhost.localdomain>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Michel,


Here are some condensed responses to Mike Riddell's questions from this URL:

   http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/beyond-greenpirate-cooperation-towards-a-european-grand-alliance-of-the-commons/2014/01/24#comment-628220


1. Specific protocols.  Not so relevant as a general question since
participants in the commons will be the ones choosing these, but with regards
to currency see #4.

2. Redefining commons.  The benefit of a commons over a market is it's
transparency and open access.

3. Networks effects.  These are very real and not Utopian.

4. Social value cannot be reduced to a number (credits).  It is relational and
intrinsic (related to #3).


-Karl


P.S. Had to send this email twice.



------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2014 09:44:42 -0800
From: Karl Robillard <krobillard@san.rr.com>
Subject: [P2P-F] Email Archives
To: p2p-foundation <p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org>
Message-ID: <1693969.xtljrfQHuP@localhost.localdomain>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

I just tried to access the email archives and noticed that they are now
private and that the URL to them on the wiki is wrong (possibly because they
became private).  When did that happen?


-Karl




------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2014 13:09:37 -0500
From: Fabio Barone <holon.earth@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [P2P-F] commons / market / currency questions by Mike
        Riddell
To: P2P Foundation mailing list <p2p-foundation@lists.ourproject.org>
Message-ID:
        <CAOL8i_kS73E0a+_2ui1gu1amg+P3GHWNBzNRjutL9xooT3qGvA@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Please allow me my contributions.
I am particularly interested in point 4 though,
in the context of a local project I am participating.
No need to say, but I do: just my personal opinions :)

1.) A commons is a commons - a shared entity - air, water, an "allmend"
(shared grazing), biodiversity, etc.
It's in the interactions of its users and their needs and accesses that its
components arise...
(in other words I mean it's probably hard to generalize)

2.) Whatever organization its users decide to adopt could work...
Local cultural issues are very important in this context

3.) The "market" is like saying "God" - it's an intangible entity really...
It depends what you mean by it. A healthy community oriented market may be
fine,
a heavily manipulated and controlled market maybe less so...

4.) I am thinking along these same lines lately. Local institutions (like
NGOs, social help groups,
alternative educational orgs, art collectives etc.)  with community
projects should get free credit
to be able to spend in circulation on local service providers, and with
sufficient diversity of participants
in the system, many needs could be served by members, making the units
circulate.

But why would outside speculators want to buy stock from these groups?
If you specifically mention speculators, they are interested in returns
only,
not in the community interest. Stocks often also imply voting power in the
community,
so this to me doesn't seem very appealing. Also, where would these people
get their returns from? It would only work if they would be interested in
returns
generated inside the community, which may be non-monetary...so there could
be little incentive for them.

Things could look differently though if there would be a purposely
sustainability/equitable stock market,
where investors wouldn't be interested in monetary returns foremost, but in
supporting great communities,
and would be open on the nature of the returns. Still this could be done in
bitcoins though (or something similar).

A very ad-hoc response admittedly so bear with me :)


2014-01-27 Karl Robillard <krobillard@san.rr.com>

> Michel,
>
>
> Here are some condensed responses to Mike Riddell's questions from this
> URL:
>
>
> http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/beyond-greenpirate-cooperation-towards-a-european-grand-alliance-of-the-commons/2014/01/24#comment-628220
>
>
> 1. Specific protocols.  Not so relevant as a general question since
> participants in the commons will be the ones choosing these, but with
> regards
> to currency see #4.
>
> 2. Redefining commons.  The benefit of a commons over a market is it's
> transparency and open access.
>
> 3. Networks effects.  These are very real and not Utopian.
>
> 4. Social value cannot be reduced to a number (credits).  It is relational
> and
> intrinsic (related to #3).
>
>
> -Karl
>
>
> P.S. Had to send this email twice.
>
> _______________________________________________
> P2P Foundation - Mailing list
> http://www.p2pfoundation.net
> https://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation
>
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End of P2P-Foundation Digest, Vol 37, Issue 48
**********************************************

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Updates: http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens

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